From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: What does it? Date & Time: 02/24/91 21:50:51 Message Number 12701 T> what are all the rest? Patent Applied For - except we all know that the US patent office refuses to patent ANY perpetual motion machine - so I hereby donate my Perpetual Maytag Motion Machine concept to the public domain. You rig it exactly the same as the communicators with the added benefit that you can still use them for that purpose - and you start one up. When the string gets wrapped so tight that it causes it to stop the unwinding action will start the other one. Since we know all about the superior operating lifetime for these units we have in essence a perpetual motion machine. An Inventive JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: Helicopters Date & Time: 02/24/91 21:55:26 Message Number 12702 T> most people assume any affectionate physical contact between T> a man and a woman is inherently sexual in nature. Righto! You wouldn't bel;ieve how many married women that I'm supposed to be having affairs with at work. My buddy Kim happens to be a very good-looking young blonde. We happen to like each other a lot and go out together for lunches, dinner, bowling, movies etc etc WITH the blessings of her husband Jeff. We give each other hugs a lot because we genuinely care a lot about each other. As you can imagine tho... everyone else tries to drag a beautiful personal relationship into the mud. Good thing we don't care. JonBoy =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/24/91 23:08:14 Message Number 12703 JB>Hug anyone that is dear to me and f*ck anyone that feels it isn't manyly. Amen, JB. Nothing makes ya feel better than a hug. When I meet someone that touches my arm when talking to me and doesn't hesitate to hug goodbye or hello, it makes me feel warm. So many people misinterpret it, though. I tend to call people "Darlin'", it's gotten me in trouble more than once. =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: Workshops Date & Time: 02/24/91 23:14:22 Message Number 12704 After reading about the "gay bob" doll, I'm sure he's laughing to hard to find his bayonet. =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: What doesn't it Date & Time: 02/24/91 23:15:52 Message Number 12705 Ah, but what word described the guy that's in love with himself..... Besides a "jerk", that is? =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: Bill Bixie Cat Date & Time: 02/24/91 23:20:24 Message Number 12707 I like it! I like it! You should add to every post..... that would drive c] with BUSH) yet you will talk all day >about your rights. Well, someone hadda die to get those rights >secured for you. Several questions for you: 1. What does fighting for a monarchic government that has NO equiv- alent to our Bill of Rights (theirs was cancelled in 1985, I believe...) have to do with saving our rights? I've never seen a connection. 2. When did I (as a person) agree to those rules? I never agreed to fight for the U.S, so far as I know. I've lived in another country, and I've spent time in many other countries. Not one of them has the religion of "rallying around the flag" that the U.S. seems to. Several may rally around a charismatic leader. Many are drawn into patriotism through their religion. But none have made the State into a religion. /Dragonfly/ =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: RUFUS Subject: Freakish fears Date & Time: 02/21/91 10:13:21 Message Number 12409 >The film procedes with animated hamburgers. Were they sentient hamburgers? /Dragonfly/ =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: SAAVIK Subject: Give it a Rest Date & Time: 02/21/91 10:18:28 Message Number 12410 >Gawd! Enough of this serious stuff, already!!! It pops up here more than occasionally. I'd say it's nearly IMPOSSIBLE to tell what a person's sexual pref- erences are from how they act. Psyche has a rather high-pitched voice for a male, yet he's completely hetero. There's a whole bunch of Spaniards who lisp (speaking Castilian), but most are hetero. There's a California furry who has two (I believe) black belts, and is bisexual. Another of my friends was a power-lifter (used to work moving whole kegs of beer) and was bi. You simply can't tell. /Dragonfly/ =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Fav shows Date & Time: 02/21/91 12:06:42 Message Number 12411 Me neither (either, ah, back to grammar school!!). I found something in all of them that interested me. But there are some I can watch again and again, and then there's some I've had enough of. I think it's kind of strange that they (meaning the syndication) seem to show the same ones over and over. For instance, they might air one episode 3 times and never air another episode. Maybe that wasn't the way to put it (tongue tied today). What I mean to say is that they don't just air the 3 season consecutively. Know what I mean? =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Rule in heaven Date & Time: 02/21/91 12:14:37 Message Number 12412 Yeah, I liked that one too. Montebon (ah, whatever his name is) was excellent in that role. Good thing Shatner didn't write that script, though. They would have both spent the entire movie quoting and launching into 5 minute speeches!!!! =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/21/91 12:17:05 Message Number 12413 I truly know what you mean. It's the same with men. That's why so many people are still single at 30 or older. It's like people are afraid to be themselves. Maybe it boils down to insecurities from childhood. I dunno. I can't tolerate phonies either and you can usually spot them right away. =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Same old situat Date & Time: 02/21/91 12:23:35 Message Number 12414 And a message, don't forget, it's actually got a message. I think people tend to hear the music and the beat without listening to the lyrics.......... =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Thank you Date & Time: 02/21/91 12:26:02 Message Number 12415 I'd like to thank all the people who made it possible, (clearing my throat and launching into a 18 minute speech). What an honor!! =========== From: SAAVIK To: DRAGONFLY Subject: You can't tell Date & Time: 02/21/91 12:30:08 Message Number 12416 And next point, you shouldn't care. Am I right? I don't care if a friend of mine (male or female) likes girls or boys. It's none of my business. Sexual pref. is a private thing. I know that if I were a lesbian, I certainly would be afraid to admit it just because of all the biased people in this world. Somethings wrong here. In a time when honesty and self respect are needed, they're being discouraged. No wonder the phych. hospitals are full. "excuse my spelling, it's the pits". =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: DRAGONFLY Subject: ********* Date & Time: 02/21/91 16:29:11 Message Number 12417 Actually I'm very good at Wheel of Fortune, but you've /still/ got me totally stumped. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Give it a Rest Date & Time: 02/21/91 16:34:35 Message Number 12418 I sure hope none of your friends mind you revealing there sexual preferences on the board. Especially your body-builder friend. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: Fav shows Date & Time: 02/21/91 16:36:23 Message Number 12419 SA>...For instance, they might air one episode 3 times and never air SA> another episode..... Yeah, I've noticed that too. Usually I can identify a show within about five to ten seconds, but occasionally I'll be stumped. Simply because I've seen almost all of them five or six times, while others almost have me convinced that I might have missed one. They should give all the episodes equal air time. You know what I'd like to see, a network air every Star Trek episode in sequential order. Whether it was back-to-back or over a period of months. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/21/91 16:43:03 Message Number 12420 Yep, I can shot them coming a mile away. (to steal a phrase you used) I'm 23, and unattached. Personally, I don't like it. As dumb as it may sound, when I was little I always figured I would be married by the time I was twenty. I've been engaged twice. Screwed over both times. I'm glad that didn't married either one of them. I would like to meet someone who's true-to-life. Do you have any suggestions as to where I can find this rare breed? I mean, just try to meet someone, for instance, in a night club. Clubs, now a days, are virtual meat-markets, nothing more. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: Thank you Date & Time: 02/21/91 16:50:49 Message Number 12421 SA> I'd like to thank all the people who made it possible, (clearing my SA> throat and launching into a 18 minute speech). What an honor!! Go ahead......Just don't post it. heheheheh :) =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: You can't tell Date & Time: 02/21/91 16:53:48 Message Number 12422 SA>....In a time when honesty and self respect are needed, they're being SA> discouraged... I wonder if that's why soooo many people are phony? Sounds logical to me. SA> ..No wonder the psychiatric hospitals are full. I hear ya, I played counselor to a lot of my friends in high school, and still do with some people today. =========== From: RUFUS To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Freakish fears Date & Time: 02/21/91 17:19:28 Message Number 12423 R>The film procedes with animated hamburgers. D> Were they sentient hamburgers? I really don't remember. Another fun thing about personal torture was when we had our 20 minute lunch break a bunch of us would go to the 7-11, buy loads of junk food and return. The lectures almost always involved half the food you saw when you looked around. "Twinkies are bad for you" you [STUPID QUOTE KEY] would hear as you sucked the creamy white preservatives out of the middle. =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Nuke the networ Date & Time: 02/21/91 18:22:14 Message Number 12425 I agree completely about airing the shows in sequence. Not just ST but all the reruns. I don't understand why they can't do it. It makes sense, (sigh) well, heaven forbid they do anything that makes sense. I know what you mean about getting stumped occasionally on a St episode. Sometimes it takes me 10 minutes in to recognize the show, usually it's something like a certain phrase that tips me off (I'm into diologue). They haven't aired the Trouble with Tribbles lately and to me, that was one of the funniest ones. It beat I, Mudd all to #$%%^. =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Clubs Date & Time: 02/21/91 18:26:43 Message Number 12426 Yeah, the clubs are a trip! I go just to "people watch". I have a lot of male friends who echo what you are saying. It seems harder and harder to make 'good' friends these days. And the only way to have a lasting relationship is to be 'best friends' with your partner...., it takes time. When I was younger, I used to think it was the guys who played all the stupid mind games, now I know better......, I've seen too many really nice guys get their minds worked over by their girlfriends. You wouldn't be interested in any of the women I know, they are either married, or as plastic as a barbie doll (with about as much personality) =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: 18 minute speec Date & Time: 02/21/91 18:31:15 Message Number 12427 Had ya worried? Don't...... I couldn't come up with a single intelligent thought that would last for 18 minutes..... but then, neither do the award winners at the grammies. "Yo, I'd like to thank all the little people who served me so well in my sprint to genius. Without them it would have taken me at least another month to win this. Chow, babies." =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Shrinks R Us Date & Time: 02/21/91 18:34:04 Message Number 12428 Same here. People just seem to know they can talk to me about, well, just about anything. It's all in the way you listen. Most people don't really want advise, they just want to release the pressure and bounce their problems off a sympathetic ear. They just need a pat on the back or a kick in the ass. =========== From: TIBERIUS To: SAAVIK Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/21/91 19:05:53 Message Number 12429 >It's all in the body language Yes, but languages seemed to be my worst subject. I get one idea, and they are saying something completely different. =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: New Topic Date & Time: 02/21/91 19:59:33 Message Number 12430 SS> least my handle isn't identical to a fag-ish character on the Walton My my... ever heard of attacking the thought and not the speaker? Hmmm? I happen to be rather proud of ALL my nom de plumes and "handles" as they were given to me by people that I cared for and reciprocated. The fact that not only did you attack Turtle's method of scraping by in the world financially, now you stoop to attacking my nom de guerre. Pitiful. It is a shame (and I lament this daily with my peers) that there are people in this world that cannot defend themselves except in underhanded fashion. I will admit that you do seem better prepared to deal with those cold little numbers rather than warm-hearted people. Please don't bother to retaliate as I have better things to do and far better people to share these things with. Good day sir. --==>JonBoy<==-- =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Slammed Date & Time: 02/21/91 20:05:37 Message Number 12431 SS> Sounds like a gay bar to me. On second thought - maybe you are a repressed homosexual in search of himself. You do seem to see the topic wherever you look. Maybe AJ can help you there - nahhh he hangs around respectable people... =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: St Date & Time: 02/21/91 20:09:24 Message Number 12432 S> ('nuff said about age) Yah! Me too! 'Cept I don't really let it bother me. I'm really glad to have been semi-cognizant of the late 60's. I have wondered many times if ST was more a product of the era than given credit for. S> But above all, do not break the Prime Directive!!!! They were pretty loose with the concept of the Prime Directive on more than one show. I wish that the technology would have been good enough to allow better and more robots with an exploration of Asimov's LAws of Robotics. S> He often launched into poetic speeches (very shaksperian... Often? You mean like the conclusion of every show? (snigger) I actually used to LOVE those gunky speeches and really used to take them to heart. I guess Kirk was a real hero figure to me - there were precious few of them at that time with rock-n-roll stars starting to gain the position of adulation that has now reached silly proportions. Nope - not many heroes for kids and Nixon really polished off the idea of our leaders being worth emulating. JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: Easy, dude Date & Time: 02/21/91 20:16:27 Message Number 12433 S> Now, boys, let's not fight here. Braaaacccckkkkkkk! o o > U (a-sometimes-rude-and-slightly-intolerant) JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/21/91 20:20:34 Message Number 12434 T> guess she wanted to share thi particular inability...grr... Now now - you should be honored to hold such a trusted position. I was just wondering - I rather liked her ability to be the supreme cold bitch with some of the upstarts and showboaters. A rare talent that was by large unappreciated. =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: St Date & Time: 02/21/91 20:23:26 Message Number 12435 T> Better than the new one, no. Well-acted, no. Ummmm - when I first started watching the STNG, I was appalled at the terrible acting and really weak story lines that were blatantly lifted from the old series. The captain was SO stilted and hard-assed that I wondered why theye didn't slit his throat and the brat was almost as bad. They have improved I am happy to say and now have settled into their roles where they finally act like real people. I worried the first year tho... =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: st Date & Time: 02/21/91 20:28:42 Message Number 12436 S> But I like it. A very nice bottom line that I'll stand behind too! S> But you know what they say about opinions..... You will learn that you should _not_ leave yourself open like that here! I call them denizens with a lot of love but some reality thrown in. You really have to watch Max (he's sneaky and has a very dry bite). =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/21/91 20:33:56 Message Number 12437 SS> I don't think any country ... could beat Hussien. So what? This has as much oomph as "my old man can whip your old man". It is a childish argument and does not merit an actual battle with lives lost. We have our nose in someone else business. In my opinion, we are over there for economic reasons and thus have sunk to the state that we have finally placed a price on human life. Sorry - I ain't having no part of it. I served 8 years in the service and would die _for my country_ but I will be damned if I _sell_ my ideals on the international block of oil cartels and industrialism. --==>* JonBoy *<==-- =========== From: JONBOY To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/21/91 20:38:28 Message Number 12438 TS> Oh, please. Come off it. C'mon Dave - or I'll take back my nice guy award. Maybe you take my wording at some other value. Maybe I should spell out my metaphors so that you can grasp them more readily. Icing is a superficially sweet condiment that is very thin and insubstantial to the bulk of the final product. Got me so far? Or are you too busy trying to look self-righteous. The yummy cake part refers to the idea that this in fact is the bulk of the product and is what is actually the most filling ie the part that isn't readily visible and covered by a thin veneer of what we arbitrarily call "beauty". You are dead wrong about the curiosity - I would like to meet many of the people on the board so I can attach a face to a string of ASCII text representing the "soul" of that person as I have gotten to know them second hand. "What" they look like as far as a silly concept of beauty and other equally repugnant (to me) biases such as sexual persuasion - has absolutely no place in MY life. If someone is pleasing to the eye - then that really is icing on the cake if they are pleasant, respectful of others, and intelligent enough to carry on a coherent conversation. Now - hey! I can leer with the best of them under the proper circum- stances - like when it is a very impersonal thing directed towards some gal that is dressed sharp, looks great and is out to show the world. I ain't saying I'm dead and my hormones don't work. But I am saying that "looks" are not what I look at or even consider when it comes to building ANY kind of relationship. I didn't give two hoots in hades about anything when we had our dinner awhile back. I didn't have any conceptions about age, fanaticism (on several topics) or what have you. I still happen to think that fundamentally you are a nice guy but you just don't think, and you really need to open up the empathy part of your psyche a bit - in short - grow up Dave. A-long-winded- JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/21/91 20:55:15 Message Number 12439 TS> Well, someone hadda die to get those rights secured for you. Tell ya what Dave - you spell out what rights that we are gaining and I'll agree that it's a necessary fight. Sigghhhh pacifism is not the same as cowaridice and sometimes (sometimes!) takes more courage. Taking another human life for the simple reason that it belongs to "another side" that simply threatens supply of a certain crude mineral deposit when we have plenty here - just turns my guts Dave. I mean like makes me want to puke. As far as your heroic war of 1776 goes - maybe France, Germany Denmark and all the other powers should have come to Britains aid with the rebellious little upstart. Now granted - our motives were a little different that the demented little bastard in Iraq, but the point is [MINDING YOUR OWN BUSINESS!] =========== From: JONBOY To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Self-improvemen Date & Time: 02/21/91 21:14:39 Message Number 12440 TS> You look forward thepain because you know .. You gotta be shitting me! I lift three times daily and I dread the pain! It _is_ necessary to a degree tho... deliberate overstressing of the muscle creates an adaptive stress response - BUT that is if you are after bulk (body building) it is also necessary to vary such activity with some sort of aerobic exercise so that the effeciency of the cells is increased. This is so that lactic acid concentrations can be avoided. If you do not build up the efficiency then weights can cause muscle deterioation from lactic acid concentrations - the cells simply can't flush themselves fast enough. Also keep in mind that as far as metabolizing fat cells - the body breaks down the tissue 50-50. You also lose muscle mass at the same time as fat so you have to make sure that you are eating properly to avoid stuff like ketosis. As far as aerobic exercise - I like raquetball - I HATE running but swimming and fast walking are excellent. =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/21/91 21:29:46 Message Number 12441 Phonies - hmmm yup there's a bunch of them out there but since they are so easy to spot - not much of a bother. I really hate the sorriest of the lot - the "sophisticate". The ones that right off the bat ask what you drive and look at your clothes to see if they're "label". Bah! The second worst are the ones that come on as really decent humans and then after you start getting into the swing - they decide that there are things that need to be changed. I just got over one of those - she decided that I really should start liking Chinese food best and stop drinking sodas because they'll rot my guts. Sheesh! Maybe she should call up the source and custom order one next time. There are many other variations to toads and toadettes - I guess ya just have to weed them out. So far my resolve to remain a bachelor (after 2 disasters) has remained firm. =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/21/91 21:39:01 Message Number 12442 SS> Do you have any suggestions as to where I can find this rare breed? You ought to see the really neat gals that hang out at the tennis courts and the raquetball courts. Of course - there are a few exceptions but I have met lots of nice people. =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: Clubs Date & Time: 02/21/91 21:41:33 Message Number 12443 SA> any of the women I know, they are either married, or as plastic Hmmm - why is that? I mean the plastic - the married I understand. =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: SAAVIK Subject: You can't tell Date & Time: 02/21/91 22:10:15 Message Number 12444 S> And next point, you shouldn't care. Am I right? Absolutely. The only time a person's sexual preference is important is when you're in bed with thon. S> I know that if I were a lesbian, I certainly would be afraid to S> admit it just because of all the biased people in this world. The thing that I've never understood: lesbians are not considered as bad as gay men, in most bigots' eyes. Imagine being male and homo- sexual in this society! /Dragonfly/ =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Give it a Rest Date & Time: 02/21/91 22:15:27 Message Number 12445 Actually, the body-builder friend has never been on the board, and I won't name him. (Several people on this board know him, and would be shocked... maybe.) He won't be named any further. /Dragonfly/ =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/21/91 22:17:27 Message Number 12446 > Do you have any suggestions as to where I can find this rare breed? Damn. The ones I know of are all married. When you talk about "clubs," do you mean dancing clubs? Or do you mean "clubs" as in organizations? The latter (depending on the organ- iazation, of course) might get you to meet some interesting people. (Kind of like my meeting Wolf in the S.C.A. That woman still scares me.) /Dragonfly/ =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: RUFUS Subject: Freakish fears Date & Time: 02/21/91 22:20:57 Message Number 12447 Twinkies are bad for you? Twinkies are bad for you? Hmph. Somewhere near an ant pile, put a bit of the cafeteria's mystery meat, and a bit of the Twinkie filling, and see which one the ants run towards. See? Even they know how good it is for you! Twinkies have lots of preservatives. Just think: you can stay your current age as long as you want! Also, Twinkies make a wonderful metaphor for life: you have to dive in, and get to the heart of things before you can really enjoy it. Also like life, it's meant for big bites. Twinkies make the almost perfect post-nuclear holocaust (sp?) food: they will last for hundreds of years. (At least the fillings...) What more could you ask for? Besides, they contain one of the Four Basic College Food Groups: Sugar. (The other three are, of course, caffeine, pizza, and alcohol.) /Dragonfly/ =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Motley Crude Date & Time: 02/21/91 22:42:01 Message Number 12448 SS>*yawn* >>SLAP!<< Pay attention, you. SS> This from a confessed hater of heavy metal. Your prejudice is SS>showing. As far as chord structure is concerned, a lot of groups, SS>both heavy metal and other forms of music, usually have three or SS>four main chords in them. Yes, like, Great White, Guns 'n' Roses, Cinderella, Poison, and what's that other one who's so generic? Oh, yeah, Motely Crue. The one redeeming factor of groups like Whitesnake and Kiss is that at least they use more than one set of chords for *all* of thier songs. SS>...and some damn good guitar riffs. Any of those groups use thier riffs just to show off how fast the lead guitarist can hammer on and pull off on his guitar...not to add to the song. They may be fast and good...just not with the pariticular son that everone else is playing at the time. By the way, WINGER is an excellent example of the lead guitar playing along with the song instead of just showing off. "Headed for a Heartache" has a lead in it which is not always "ripping up the frets" but still comes off as a fantastic riff, *with* the added bonus of going with the song that's being played. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/21/91 22:54:23 Message Number 12449 DF>When did I (as a person) [moot] agree to those rules> Ok, so you are saying that you want your rights but don't feel like taking care of your responsibilities? =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: JONBOY Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/21/91 23:04:33 Message Number 12450 JB>[soapbox speil about the middle east...in an overacted fashion] Oh, please... =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: JONBOY Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/21/91 23:06:41 Message Number 12451 JB>[another "long-winded" speil...] grow up, Dave. Ok, ok, no need to get defensive. I just choked on your message, that's all. Your chivalrous (spoken in Dudley Dooright tones), "Now, now, fellows, what she looks like is not important. What *is* important is that she can carry on an intelligent conversation!" line just stuck me as bull...just a little *too* altruistic. When I am certain that we all are curious what this "ideal" woman looks like. Savvik, if I am being offensive, I aplogise. I used the word "ideal" because, well, you do have a lot of qualities that people on this board find appealing. The first and foremost (and probably the least common among women) is that you are a ST fan. Next would come your well spoken nature and sense of humor. (No, I am not sucking up, which I know SS will accuse me of.) Keep in mind that not a whole lot of women use BBS's...much less ST fans! Curious...naturally! =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: JONBOY Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/21/91 23:17:37 Message Number 12452 JB>...but the point is [MINDING YOUR OWN BUSINESS!] Sounds like someone is still a little shell-shocked from Viet Nam...eh? =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: DRAGONFLY Subject: You can't tell Date & Time: 02/21/91 23:20:54 Message Number 12453 DF>;lesbians are not considered as bad as gay men in most bigot's eyes uh huh. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: ALL Subject: Shameless Plug Date & Time: 02/21/91 23:24:41 Message Number 12454 And now, a word from our user: Ok, for anyone who is interested, the story board is now active on Uncle Bob's Alligator Farm and Tofu Museum. Setting is a space station, and the moderator is yours truly. (And don't worry, I am a fair moderator.) Participators-to-be should read the storyline description in the text files area.... FIRST! =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: Clubs Date & Time: 02/22/91 01:52:34 Message Number 12456 SA> You wouldn't be interested in any of the women I know, they are either married, or as plastic as a barbvie doll. Yeah! (sign) Sometimes I wonder if there is any hope. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: Shrinks R Us Date & Time: 02/22/91 01:54:48 Message Number 12457 I try to give sound advice, for some reason (which I don't know) I seem to almost radiate an air of trust. A lot of people, including people I have only known for a few minutes, will open up to me about personal matters. Granted it's sometimes it's uncomfortable, but I try my best. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: JONBOY Subject: New Topic Date & Time: 02/22/91 01:59:13 Message Number 12458 Well, I will respond, not retaliate. You caught me in a bad way, the way you said I obvious didn't know the Specialist. He happens to be one of my best friends. And for some reason I got offended. So please accept my apologies. Show me that you're a better person then I thought you were by doing so. I like numbers, they are black and white, not full of inconsistencies like people are. I can't deal very well with gray areas in life. I strive to make them clear and concise. Although I do possess the ability to help others with their problem (believe it o or not) I have a hard time finding workable solutions to my own. Kind of like, "Those who can't do, teach." Again, my apologies. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: JONBOY Subject: Slammed Date & Time: 02/22/91 02:06:15 Message Number 12459 In previous message I apologized to you, now I think you owe me one. I think you're using the same tactics you accused me of. I'm /not/ shallow, and definitely not gay. I highly doubt the Specialist and I would be "co-habitating" if that was the case. And yes I /do/ have respectable qualitites. Just a warning, I'd like to end this misunderstanding now, before you /do/ piss me off. I was wrong initially now you're attacking me in the same way. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: JONBOY Subject: St Date & Time: 02/22/91 02:12:03 Message Number 12460 JB> I guess Kirk was a real hero figure to me.... Yeah, he was to me too. I guess that's why I have a hard time finding fault with him. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: JONBOY Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/22/91 02:17:26 Message Number 12461 JB> ...you really need to open up the empathy part of your psyche a bit JB> -in short-grow up Dave. First of all, I don't know how long you've known the Specialist but I've known him almost as long as he's been living in Florida (just 4 months shy). But, one thing I'd never him to do is grow up. He is rather mature in a lot of ways. Yes he is set in his ways, and can be rather cold and insensitive. But telling him to grow up I think is uncalled for. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: JONBOY Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/22/91 02:25:28 Message Number 12462 Agreed, I hate those two questions, "What kinda car do you drive? " "what do you do for a living?" They're almost saying, will I be embarassed if my friends see me in your car, and do you make enough money to spoil me. As far as I'm concerned that type of women is an instant write-off. JB> So far my resolve to remain a bachelor (after 2 disasters) has JB> remained firm. Have you been married twice, or just engaged twice, like me? =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: JONBOY Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/22/91 02:29:34 Message Number 12463 Where do you play raquetball? I used to play at Jessie P. Miller. I love raquetball, but, due to a back injury, I haven't been able to pla play in almost a year. I used to be pretty good. Maybe if we can solve our differnces we can get together and play sometimes!?! =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: JONBOY Subject: Clubs Date & Time: 02/22/91 02:31:39 Message Number 12464 JB> Hmmm - wht is that? I mean the plastic - the married I understand. Yeah, I meant to ask that same question. Are your "plastic" friends just acquitances or are they "real" with you and plastic towards men? =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/22/91 02:34:46 Message Number 12465 As far as clubs go, I'm referring to dance clubs. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Motley Crude Date & Time: 02/22/91 02:37:09 Message Number 12466 Well, if nothing else I appreciate the fact that you mentioned Kiss, Whitesnake, and Winger in a positive manner. (Three of my favorite groups) Also, Queensryche is one of my faves too. I do like the Crue but I wouldn't refer to them as one of my favorite groups. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/22/91 02:41:47 Message Number 12467 TS> (in reference to Saavik) (no, I am not sucking up, which I know SS will accuse me of.) Wrong. I'm offended. Dave,(note I'm using your real name) you should know that I know you'd never make a play for a married woman. That's just not your style. You were being complimentary in an objective manner, but you were not sucking up. Anyone can see Saavik has a goood sense of humor and can express herself well. A rather offended, (feeling accused of being shallow) Scott Steel =========== From: KNIGHT OWL To: DRAGONFLY Subject: ********* Date & Time: 02/22/91 10:18:25 Message Number 12468 I STILL haven't any idea... can ya gimme another clue? (please?) Thanks, Knight Owl =========== From: KNIGHT OWL To: DRAGONFLY Subject: 'E' Date & Time: 02/22/91 10:19:49 Message Number 12469 ...eight cinsonants in a row! Anything's possible...that's why I asked. Knight Owl =========== From: KNIGHT OWL To: JONBOY Subject: origin Date & Time: 02/22/91 10:37:03 Message Number 12470 Just outta curiousity, what is the origin of your handle? =========== From: SAAVIK To: TIBERIUS Subject: How not to Date & Time: 02/22/91 12:41:20 Message Number 12471 Don't assume anything. Just make your observations silently and throw out little tests......, that's how not to get slapped and how to perfect reading body language. There's some people out there you can't read no matter what. THEY don't even know what they are going to do from moment to moment. =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: Heros Date & Time: 02/22/91 12:45:20 Message Number 12472 Look at the hero types presented to children in that era. Superman, Bat man, no wonder Charles Manson had so many followers.... at least he was human, eh? Don't misunderstand, I am disgusted by Charles Manson and his family, I was just making the comment that all the hero's were impossible examples to follow. At least Kirk was a man, ( and a good looking one at that). =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: Very cute Date & Time: 02/22/91 12:48:36 Message Number 12473 What, do you sit up nights coming up with these things...... very cute, Jonboy. =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: Weeding Date & Time: 02/22/91 12:54:36 Message Number 12474 Weed them out, I like that. But you know, almost everyone has something good about them...... Even the plastics and the phonies, it just takes a little longer to get past the bullshit and down to the real person. Persistence and patience sometimes do pay off, but it's a gamble. Plastics usually have false expectations from life and relationships and they don't have the patience or fortitude to "get to know" anyone past "like you said" what year Beamer they drive or what boutique they shop in. This goes for relationships in general, not just man-woman. I'd rather have 1 good friend than 20 plastic friends. But I must admit, I considered some of my friends plastic when I first met them (but they melted) =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: plastic Date & Time: 02/22/91 12:59:51 Message Number 12475 Well, they aren't plastic to me anymore but I've seen them around men, especially when they first meet them. It's sickening. They put on this phoney facade of sophistication and seduction...... I mean, I like to flirt as much as the next woman but these chicks, they build a guy up to think that he's getting some kind of rich, nymphmaniac, wonder woman and THEN, two weeks after the first date, BLAM!!!! Reality sinks in. They just don't know how to be themselves and "talk". It's all BS =========== From: SAAVIK To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/22/91 13:03:40 Message Number 12476 Men don't think "Lesbian" when they think of two women together. They think "Hey, ladies, room for one more???". Like it's all some kind of warm up to "the real thing". There's no way you could turn that around for men. Two guys together, I don't know a single woman who'd like sloppy seconds on that one. (sorry for the rude remark). I don't think men are offended by bi-sexual women at all. "After all, she ain't been anywhere I ain't been before." Says Macho man. =========== From: SAAVIK To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: curious Date & Time: 02/22/91 13:10:05 Message Number 12477 And I am as curious as you guys are. Posting and replying on the boards is like getting to know someone over the phone before you meet them. ( (exactly the same thing). People are more apt to be themselves and speak out (even if they are painfully shy in public) over the phone or on a BBS. I regret more women don't post on the BBS's, they would gain a great insight into the true mind of men and themselves as well. =========== From: SAAVIK To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: co plug Date & Time: 02/22/91 13:13:54 Message Number 12478 Co-plug..... I read the first parts...... "Good reading... Check it out y'all!!!" =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Hope Date & Time: 02/22/91 13:15:01 Message Number 12479 Never give up hope. =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Shrink R Us Date & Time: 02/22/91 13:15:49 Message Number 12480 Sometimes it's hard to keep a straight face...... But I'd never insult anyone by laughing at them. It's just that to some people, the smallest annoyance is a BIG problem. "Back to those plastic people again." No matter how small the problem seems to me, I'll still listen, I guess that's why they keep coming....., eh? =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Clubs Date & Time: 02/22/91 13:19:46 Message Number 12481 SS> Are they real with you and plastic towards men? . Yes. Exactly. Although I think they use me sometimes just to get close to my male friends. I have a lot of male friends, left over from my rock n roll band days. These girls will be talking to me like a normal human being and if one of the guys walk up..... BOOM they shift into this sickening mascarade (sp?). It makes me want to shake them and yell "GROW UP". And they wonder why their relationships don't last.....No one can put on an act forever and eventually they began to resent the poor guy because they feel they have to "be all things to all men"...... =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Thank you Date & Time: 02/22/91 13:25:29 Message Number 12482 Thank you, Scott. It's easy to have a sence of humor in this "Alter Reality". Difficult concept, eh? =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: Weeding Date & Time: 02/22/91 17:21:12 Message Number 12484 SA> I'd rather have 1 good friend than 20 plastic friends. Here, here. I only have a few friends, which is of my own choosing. I only allow a few people to get close to me. Most people I don't find worthy(that's not a very good word but I can't think of another) of my friendship. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: Hope Date & Time: 02/22/91 17:26:56 Message Number 12485 Well, like I wrote earlier, I've been engaged twice and screwed over hard. Do you want to hear this? It is a long story. I've just found it virtually impossible to get to really know most women. Not that I have a hard time communicating with women, but they just won't open up. They play their games and dance around questions. Arrrrghh, honesty do you really want to hear this? =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Worthy? Date & Time: 02/22/91 18:34:20 Message Number 12487 SS> Most people I don't find worty of my friendship. . That sounded pretty concieted but I knew what you meant. True friends are usually easy to be with. Those "plastic" people are a strain on your patience. I find myself constantly trying to educate them on being "real". But (sigh), who am I to tell them how to lead their lives. =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Do I wanna.... Date & Time: 02/22/91 18:37:46 Message Number 12488 SS> Do you really want to hear this? . Yeah, I do. I like hearing a man's point of view. I used to think it was the men who played all the games, but now that I'm "all grown up", and not in the game anymore, I can see who's screwing with who's mind. The women are definately doing the F*ckovers out there. Not to say that all men are just innocent bystanders being plodded on by "mean evil" women. =========== From: TURTLE To: BEATLE Subject: ST movies Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:18:20 Message Number 12489 >BTW, did anybody see the TNG episode called "Devil's Due"? Very anti- >religious (evil grin)... I saw it, and got it on tape. I didn't find it anti-religious at all; just anti-con-artist. =========== From: TURTLE To: BEATLE Subject: ST stuff Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:19:24 Message Number 12490 I don't know how many Original Trek episodes he has left. He has "The Menagerie" and "Where No Man Has Gone Before;" I think he may have sold the rest. He still has the movies, though. =========== From: TURTLE To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:21:18 Message Number 12491 >Okay, so maybe Max is not a yellow belly coward...But I doubt it. Of course you doubt it; otherwise you wouldn't have called him a coward in the first place. I'm not debating with you, since once you have your mind set on something it doesn't change and I suspect you'd still call Max a coward even if you saw him in the front seat of a tank. My point was not to argue about it, I simply state that you are wrong. As to who I'd rather have in Kuwait, certainly not Hussein. It still doesn't take 200,000 troops to kill one man. This is simple stuff, fingers-and-toes arithmetic, you know? "But that would leave his army intact." So? It's not like squashing it is going to keep Hussein's successor from building military power, and it's not like Hussein's successor is gonna use it like Hussein did to begin with. Squashing Hussein would have caused his occupation of Kuwait to fall apart over- night. So far, squashing his army hasn't. =========== From: TURTLE To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Deal! Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:26:10 Message Number 12492 >All fags do not act alike, but a great many of them have traits in >common. I know, and I still think it's a sure thing...none of the people Max was referring to have any of the traits one would normally associate with gays. Okay, so maybe it's a stacked deck...no tipoffs, no limp wrists. You really sure you want to give it a shot? If you're looking for common traits, you're gonna be in trouble... =========== From: TURTLE To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Give it a Rest Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:28:30 Message Number 12493 >I say they [Motley Crue] lack the ability to write music because a >good 80% of their songs use the same chords in the same fashion... Only 80%? There are good Motley Crue songs, but I'd say they comprise far less than 20% of that group's works to date...and most of the Crue stuff I like isn't terribly popular. My opinion: 80% of their stuff is crap, 15% is tolerable at low volumes in controlled doses, and 5% is worth listening to. Of that latter 5%, about half of it is actually good. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Opinions Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:31:27 Message Number 12494 >Ok, ok, opinions are like assholes, everybody has one. There, are >you happy???? Ecstatic. Elated. Jump in air, clap paws together, squeal with glee. (Do animals without fur have paws? I'm not sure...I have opposing thumbs, though...) >No offence intended, Darlin'. "Darlin'"????? >I would really like to see a Post-It fish. Well, get a fish and some Post-It adhesive... :) =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Motley Crue Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:35:06 Message Number 12495 >Motley Crue ain't all bad. Beats Lawrence Welk. But then again, >what doesn't it? What doesn't it what? Do (like, say, emit coherent light, or open cans of tuna)? Beat (like, say, Metallica or an inside strait)? Or are we talking about what doesn't beat Lawrence Welk (an appendectomy with a chainsaw, Mike Tyson)? Enquiring minds want to know! =========== From: TURTLE To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Fav Shows Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:38:13 Message Number 12496 >But, all in all I really don't dislike any of the show. Not even the hippie episode? That's amazing! =========== From: TURTLE To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: st Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:44:02 Message Number 12497 T> No, what DO they say about opinions? SS>Not necessarily factual, but only perspective. I like Saavik's better. =========== From: TURTLE To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:46:58 Message Number 12498 >It seems that so many people have given up hope on real relation- >ships, and have substituted cheap thrills. Yes and no. Yes, that is true; no, it's nothing new. Human beings, the rational beings they are, will make rational decisions about almost every aspect of their lives EXCEPT THE MOST IMPORTANT, which has always been something that utterly baffles me. When it comes to dealings and interactions with other people, especially the intimate kind, people in general switch off the ol' forebrain and run on instinct...let knee-jerk reactions like jealousy or posession or security or territory or simple fear make their decisions for them. Go figure. =========== From: TURTLE To: KNIGHT OWL Subject: protocols Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:51:10 Message Number 12499 ANSI is a cursor-positioning standard (baserd on the DEC VT-102 terminal standard) that has nothing to do with graphics. A lot of people confuse ANSI cursor positioning with IBM graphics characters and if you want one you get both. A terminal which emulates ANSI (like mine) still will not be able to produce IBM graphics characters unless your computer has an IBM character generator or a software driver of some sort. Your best bet is just to leave it turned off, since ANSI is as slow as frozen molasses in zero gee anyway. There are BBS packages (Telegard comes to mind) that let you switch ANSI and IBM Graphics on and off independantly, but most BBSes don't (I suspect because most IBM programmers don't know that ANSI and IBM graphics are not the same thing). =========== From: TURTLE To: DRAGONFLY Subject: ST stuff Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:55:16 Message Number 12500 It's still available. Tell Raven to get in touch with me and I'll see about getting him the ferret from Tampa. I think it's about a year old; it's litter-trained already and very tame (and it's not the albino variety). =========== From: TURTLE To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Give War agin Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:56:33 Message Number 12501 I think you've hit the nail on the head, so to speak; The Specialist claims to despise religion, but damned if his attitude toward his country doesn't look, functionally, like a religion. If it walks like a duck... =========== From: TURTLE To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Give it a Rest Date & Time: 02/22/91 20:58:11 Message Number 12502 >I'd say it's nearly IMPOSSIBLE to tell what a person's sexual pref- >erences are from how they act. Much as I loathe to say it, once again I find myself in The Specialist's camp on this one. If there were no reasonably consistent behavioral traits, there would be no stereotype associated with "gay behavior;" after all, stereotypes are based, however loosely, on fact. There ARE traits that some gays exhibit which identify their sexual preference; if you deny this I invite you to look around campus some- time. I don't believe these traits are as common among gays as The Specialist seems to believe; they certainly aren't universal, nor are they always accurate. They do undeniably exist, though. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:01:47 Message Number 12503 >It's like people are afraid to be themselves. Ding. >Maybe it boils down to insecurities... Ding. >...from childhood. Or anywhere else. There are other factors involved, but basic insecurity is a big one. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Same old situat Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:03:31 Message Number 12504 >I think people tend to hear the music and the beat without listening >to the lyrics... Not this person. Lyrics are the most important part of a song, although by themselves they can't make up for truly atrocious music. I don't like the sledgehammer approach to lyrical writing that most people seem to employ, though; you know, the "If ya got something to say it say it directly" philosophy. Subtlety is a good thing; for example, I wonder how many people know the Don Henley song "All She Wants To Do Is Dance" is about the U.S. involvement in Central and South America? Good lyrics. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: You can't tell Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:06:13 Message Number 12505 >I don't care if a friend of mine...likes girls or boys. Men or women, surely you mean. Just a minor quibble, but I have an attitude toward people who molest children that makes The Specialist's reaction to gays seem downright loving. >Somethings wrong here. Ding. =========== From: TURTLE To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:08:40 Message Number 12506 >I mean, just try to meet someone, for instance, in a night club. Hey! I resent that...one of my closest friends (and a former roommate) used to /work/ in a night club, as a dancer. While I see your point, it is possible to meet "real people" /anywhere/. You just have to know what you're looking for, know how to recognize it when you see it, and know what to do when you recognize it...and in this sort of situation, "he who hesitates is lost" holds true more often than "look before you leap," at least as far as being willing to reveal enough of yourself to begin a real intimate (as opposed to physically intimate, which is easy) relationship is concerned. Nothing to it. (Nothing to defusing land mines either: ya just gotta know how to spot 'em, how to dig 'em up without setting 'em off, and how to get the detonator out in one piece...) =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Clubs Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:15:51 Message Number 12507 >It seems harder and harder to make 'good' friends these days. is it really getting harder these days, or is it as you grow more experienced you can recognize more easily when what you have isn't it? I hardly think it's the state of the society that's changing; after all, we are still coming down off the "me" 70's and the "ego trip" 80's. =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: St Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:19:42 Message Number 12508 The New Generation's first season is rather like the old Trek's third-- nine-month-long ghastly mistakes. I'm glad the Next Generation finally settled into something that's consistently wirth watching...I refused to watch most of the first season. By and large, I prefer the new Trek to the old, although the old still had a few amazing episodes that really shine (and still haven't been matched in the new), and the old has the new's first season beat cold. =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:25:15 Message Number 12509 >The second worst are the ones that come on like decent human >beings [and]...decide there are things that need to be changed. I'd put them at number 3. Number two are the people who come on like decent human beings until the magical instant you start having a Relationship, at which time you become part and parcel of their property...they suddenly feel they have the right to control who you see, where you go, what you do and when, etc. I've known a couple of people like that, although never had to deal with any on any sort of a "going-out" relationship. Speaking of which: I never could grok the distinction a lot of people see between relationships (ie, close friendships) and Relationships; to me they seem to be on a contimuum, but a lot of people I've talked to seem to see them as qualitatively different. Ditto for attitudes like "I love you; I'm just not 'in love' with you," as though emotional intimacy comes in different flavors. Manifest Bullshit if ever I saw it. =========== From: TURTLE To: DRAGONFLY Subject: You can't tell Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:29:54 Message Number 12510 >The thing I've never understood: Lesbians are not considered as bad >as [male gays]... An observation I made a long time ago. It's a male-dominated society, still, and if you're male the thought of two women sleeping together is not likely to have the same gut-churning impact as the thought of two men sleeping together. Pick up any 'Penthouse Forum' type magazine and you'll see all sorts of two-girls-making-it stories, but never, ever a two-guys-making-it incident. I even know some rather...opinionated anti-gay bigots who are actively turned on by the prospect of two women sleeping together. Go figure. =========== From: TURTLE To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Lupine people Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:33:12 Message Number 12511 >(Kind of like my meeting Wolf in the S.C.A. That woman still scares >me.) Wolf? She's mostly harmless. I've known /real/ scary women...hell, I've lived with really scary women. Wolf isn't scary. =========== From: TURTLE To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Motley Crude Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:35:58 Message Number 12512 >Any of those groups use thier riffs just to show off how fast the >lead guitarist can hammer on and pull off on his guitar...not to add >to the song. You know, it's really starting to bother me that I am agreeing with you on matters of taste now. Sadly, there it is: I agree. hat's why, on the whole, I'd rather have my tongue sandpapered off than listen to, say, Poison... On the other hand, that assessment isn't as universally true as I think you thnk it is, so maybe there's some hope. =========== From: TURTLE To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:39:20 Message Number 12513 >Sounds like someone is still a little shell-shocked from Viet Nam...eh? Oh, give it a rest. You and I both know that if the people who founded this country saw what we are doing they'd vomit...and I'd be standing in line to use the toilet right behind them. Supporting a war to re- establish a dictator in a brutal, repressive country...silliest damn idea I ever heard of. Making it sound like fighting for this tyrant is the most patriotic thing any American citizen who values freedom and liberty could ever do...pathetic. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: How not to Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:44:18 Message Number 12514 >There's some people out there you can't read no matter what. THEY >don't even know what they are going to do from moment to moment. Yes, there are people whose body language you can't read, but no, that's not usually why. Lots of different things can make someone's body language unreadable...anything from time in jail to martial arts training to simple closedness and emotional defensiveness. I've seen people who have taken unreadability to an art form. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:47:55 Message Number 12515 >I don't think men are offended by bi-sexual women at all. Depends on the man. I know of at least one who is... =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: curious Date & Time: 02/22/91 21:48:39 Message Number 12516 >I regret more women don't post on the BBS's, ... Ever hear of the phrase "board rape"? I know very well why more women don't post on BBS's...I've seen more than one be driven away from BBS's in general because of unpleasant experiences on one or two systems. Everything from endless E-mail to harassment in the message bases and even harassment from the sysop. It's surprising how common it is. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Opinions Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:09:34 Message Number 12517 T> Darlin'???? . Don't take it personal. I call everyone Darlin'. It's just how I talk. T> Get a fish and some Post it adhesive. . Last time I checked, the only thing that sticks to fish is slime. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: What doesn't it Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:12:14 Message Number 12518 I meant to say, Beats Lawrence Welk, but then again, what doesn't (beat Lawrence Welk). Hey, what can I say??? Are enquiring minds satisfied? =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Hippie show Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:14:19 Message Number 12519 "I'm going to Eden, yeah, yeah, yeah. Totally stupid. As a hard core ST fan, MY intelligence was insulted by that one. It was an appeal to the drug culture.... Peace, baby. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:17:42 Message Number 12520 When it comes to dealings... with other people, esspecially the intimate kind, people in general swith off the (condensed) brain and run on instinct .... go figure. . Go figure, indeed. When you sit down in front of your computer, you usually know what to expect. You know how it works and why.., but when it comes to relationships (both intimate and casual), you never really know what's going on in the noble head of the other person. Instict is all ya' got. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:23:30 Message Number 12521 T> There are other factors involved...... . Do you think a person who has had a sound childhood and made it past the adolesent BS with flying colors can become insecure as an adult. Most of the people I knew in High school who were considered "winners" are still just that. Barring something totally traumatic happening to you as an adult, I think if you have it together through your teens, you've got a good chance at being a "real person". Plastic people generally lacked sincere love and affections as children and teens. Agree? =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Same old situat Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:28:45 Message Number 12522 I didn't know that....., hmmm, I'll have to listen to that song again. I'm into lyrics myself. If the music's good but the lyrics suck, the song doesn't interest me. That's why I hated DISCO (both the lyrics and the music stunk). =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: You can't tell Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:30:58 Message Number 12523 T>Men or women, surely you mean. . Surely I did. (quibble, quibble) And as for child molesters, "BOOM", I can't believe they keep turning them loose. (they, meaning the law). My son was molested when he was three years old, and the son of a $%^& tried his best to pull a THREE YEAR OLD child on the witness stand. It was a tactic by the defence to weaken the case. I'm happy (happy?) to say, the son of a bitch got 30 years from a plea bargain. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Land mines Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:36:50 Message Number 12524 Nice comparison. But this day and age, he who hesitates may be lost but he's not gonna die of AIDS. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Clubs Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:38:27 Message Number 12525 T> As you grow more experienced you can recognize more easily when what you have, isn't it....(good friends). . I concede. The world isn't changing, I am. If the 70's were the ME age, and the 80's were the "EGO TRIP", what do you predict for the 90's? =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:41:56 Message Number 12526 T> "I love you; I'm just not 'in love' with you," as though emotional T> intimacy comes in different flavors. Bullshit? . No, there is a difference. I love you means (or should mean) I accept you and I want to be with you and only you. I love you; I'm just not in love with you means I care for you, I don't want to lose you're friendship but you just ain't doing it for me. It's the last thing a guy says before he never calls you again (unless it's to get your sisters phone number). Not actually true. Haven't you ever had a intimate relationship with someone that wasn't going well for one reason or the other but you didn't want to lose them???? You loved them, but you knew that this wasn't "it". =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: How not to Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:50:21 Message Number 12527 >I've seen people who have taken unreadability to an art form. Yes, that's true. I've met people who were very cold at first impression but they usually turn out to be very nice people once you get past the defence shields. Most people won't make the effort to melt the ice, however. It's the same with shy people, they're branded as snobs because they don't leap into conversations or look people in the eye. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:53:34 Message Number 12528 S>Men aren't offended by bi-sexual women T>I know of at least one who is.... . Would his name happen to be Turtle? =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: curious Date & Time: 02/22/91 22:55:20 Message Number 12529 >It's surprising how common it is.(board rape, harrassment) . I haven't come across it yet. I haven't been posting all that long, though. I suppose there are "jerks" every where. I have this habit of calling people (both male and female) Darlin' and Babe. I suppose I should refrain on the boards so I won't encourage the "jerks". I'm basically a open person and I like to post like I talk. Thanks for the warning. =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: New Topic Date & Time: 02/22/91 23:16:46 Message Number 12530 SS> Again - my aplogies Accepted A-most-benign- JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Slammed Date & Time: 02/22/91 23:18:00 Message Number 12531 SS> I was wrong initially Yup - you sure were - see how it spread into further misunderstandings? I agree let's drop it as I really was out of line in suggesting that you were hiding in the closet - I also did not intend on any allusions between you and Dave - although I CAN see where you two would be best friends - mutual bigot society and all that. Anyway - Dave can attest that I really am a nice guy and we really should try to get the whole gang together sometime. JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/22/91 23:21:52 Message Number 12532 SS> I think is uncalled for - Well - I don't just as Dave can bash gays - I can bash bigots and even trounce a few chauvanists in my time. If you want to live by the sword figuratively speaking you should be prepared to answer for your remarks. I happen to feel that bigotry is a sign of an immature mind. JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/22/91 23:24:31 Message Number 12533 I hate to admit that I was actually lured into marriage twice by unscrupulus females. (beat me hurt me!) JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/22/91 23:26:04 Message Number 12534 SS> Solve our diffewrences - Well I have never ever let something silly like a minor disagreement get in the way of getting to know someone. I go all the time to Jesse P. Miller as it is the only free one left in Bradenton. =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Clubs Date & Time: 02/22/91 23:27:40 Message Number 12535 SS> real towards you and plastic towards men? Exactly! =========== From: JONBOY To: KNIGHT OWL Subject: origin Date & Time: 02/22/91 23:29:21 Message Number 12536 It's very simple - my name is Jon and my friends and his kids started just calling me that ages ago and it has stuck. =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: Very cute Date & Time: 02/22/91 23:31:37 Message Number 12537 SA> very cute Thank you - nahhhh after awhile they just come to you - I did spend a lot of time on my Bill the Cat Bixie (what the ascii doo-dads aree called) I might send it if ya ask nice. =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/22/91 23:34:44 Message Number 12538 SA> ... sloppy seconds ... well after a few seconds of gasping for air between giggles we have to admit that you ARE in rare form tonite - I love outspoken people. =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: Clubs Date & Time: 02/22/91 23:36:55 Message Number 12539 SA> rock-n-roll band days... Screeeetttcchhhhhhhhhhh!!!! Now ya got my attention (Dave's too!) You have to clue us in on this aspect of yourself (being a guitar player =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: curious Date & Time: 02/22/91 23:50:18 Message Number 12540 Exactly why I made the comment that I did. SAAVIk made a comment that indicated that she was a little hesitant and here comes the comments on looks --- I get kind of tired of remarks like tese that reinforce the idea that that is all they are worth. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Motley Crude Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:03:36 Message Number 12541 SS> Kiss, Whitesnake, and Winger SS> I do like the Crue but I wouldn't refer to them as one of my SS> fav groups. Well, I could class Winger as one of my favs...but the only stuff that I like from Kiss is thier old stuff...and Whitesnake...eh... =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SAAVIK Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:07:57 Message Number 12542 S>[remarks on men don't think "lesbian" about two women...but two men S>turn women off...] Actually, I do think "lesbian"; actualy, the word that comes to mind is "dyke". I think that the reason men don't feel so bad towards woman-woman is that they don't think that both women can be as homely as mud covered fences. Most men think beautiful woman with a beautiful woman, and this appeals to them--because if one beautiful woman is a pleasure to watch, then two is twice the pleasure! Now with this in mind, take a look at the stereotype there--a beautiful woman is a pleasure to behold. On the flip side of the coin, a woman (or most women, excuse me if I am dead wrong but figger the odds) looks for masculinity in a man. So one man who is masculine is a pleasure to behold (to a woman). Two men together...well, it kinda blows that masculinity away. (Excuse the pun.) So, naturally a woman wouldn't be interested in non-masculine men. (And you CAN'T tell ME that a man who does sexual acts with another man is in ANY way shape or form masculine. He may have the physique of Adonis but if he sucks dick (pardon) he is NOT masculine.) As for myself...I am against homosexuality anyway.... =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SAAVIK Subject: curious Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:17:15 Message Number 12543 Y'know, if everyone is so curious, there is a great way to meet. About once a month, Charles Dittel (the sysop of Suncoast City BBS 9535505 or something like that) holds a breakfast/lunch get together (commonly called the Suncoast City Picknick--yes, spelled like that). You should make plans to come to the next one. Bring yer hubby, too. Great idea! Or, come to the next RufusCon. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SAAVIK Subject: Do I wanna.... Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:21:42 Message Number 12544 SS>Do you really want to hear this? S> Yeah, I do. Ahrhg! Don't encourage him!!! =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: TURTLE Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:23:12 Message Number 12545 I don't think squashing Hussien would be that easy. Assassination is very tricky. Besides, this needs to be a joint effort...to show the world that the UN is "United" Nations...not just United States. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: TURTLE Subject: Fine. Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:25:21 Message Number 12546 T>You really sure you want to give it a shot? Yes, but let's do it via E-Mail. I don't wanna offend anyone without a good reason. You list the people, I'll put down the odds. (Like a percentage of how sure I am.) How much money do you want to put on it? =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: TURTLE Subject: Give it a Rest Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:27:13 Message Number 12547 T>...80% of thier stuff is crap, 15% is tolerable at low volumes in T>controlled doses, and 5% is worth listening to. Of that latter 5%, T>about half of it is actually good. Sounds pretty accurate, but I wouldn't use the word "good", I'd say adequate. Looks like we're agreeing again...hell with it. I agree. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: TURTLE Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:30:49 Message Number 12548 T>...EXCEPT THE MOST IMPORTANT...let knee-jerk reactions...make thier T>decisions for them. Thank you Turtle for that analytical assessment. Predictable. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: TURTLE Subject: Give War agin Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:33:29 Message Number 12549 I never claimed to despise religion...I simply agree with someo fo your viewpoints. Actually, some of the things you find in religion (stripped of thier Godliness) are pretty good guidelines for life. T>If it walks like a duck... Then investigate it, and make sure that you don't make any asinine assumtions. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: TURTLE Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:41:47 Message Number 12550 T>Supporting a war to re-establish a dictator in a brutal, repressvie T>country Irrelevant. We are fighting to restore a government, irreguardless of what that government is like. That dictatorship is the *proper* government of that country, and we are fighting to restore the govnt, not the brutality or repressiveness (not intentionally, anyway.) Oh, and by the way, you don't seem to understand that the brutality or repressivness is *part* of that government, and just because *you* percieve it doesn't mean that they do. It's the way they run thier country and if that's the way they want to run it, that's thier business. Or do you want to wish our way of running things on every one else, too? =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: TURTLE Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:48:24 Message Number 12551 S>I don't think men are offended by bi-sexual women at all. T>Depends on the man. I know of at least one who is... And who would that be? =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SAAVIK Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:52:38 Message Number 12552 S>Men aren't offended by bi-sexual women T>I know of at least one who is.... . S>Would his name happen to be Turtle? HEHAHAHHEHAHEHAHEHAHEHAEHEHAEHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!! NO WAY!! Chortle...chuckle...thanks for the laugh...heheh. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: JONBOY Subject: Slammed Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:54:56 Message Number 12553 JB>Anyway- Dave can attest that I really am a nice guy and we really Er...yeah, I guess that he's ok. Got a nasty left hook, though. Don't irritate him and discuss things with him in an intelligent manner and he's pretty docile. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: JONBOY Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:56:36 Message Number 12554 JB>I happen to feel that bigotry is a sign of an immature mind. Either that or we know something that you haven't found out yet. Think about it.... =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: JONBOY Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 00:57:36 Message Number 12555 JB>...lured into marriage twice... (beat me hurt me!) Make me write bad checks! =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SAVVIK Subject: Band Date & Time: 02/23/91 01:05:35 Message Number 12556 S> rock-n-roll band days... JB>[Screetch!] Now you got my attention (and Dave's)! Fill us in... Yes, please do...I wonder how that message got past me...? =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: Worthy? Date & Time: 02/23/91 04:10:59 Message Number 12557 Mt sentiments exactly. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: TURTLE Subject: Fav Shows Date & Time: 02/23/91 04:16:15 Message Number 12558 Honetsly I can't remember much about the hippie episode. Please provide me with some details, then I can give a more informed opinion. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: TURTLE Subject: st Date & Time: 02/23/91 04:17:44 Message Number 12559 I think Saavik's definition of opinions is more suited for today's world But I think mine is more Vulcan sounding, and that's good enough for me. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 04:29:30 Message Number 12560 Plastic people generally lacked sincere love and affections as children and teens. Agree? (quote from Saavik, forgot S>) No, I don't agree. I was brought up in a home where threats of divorce were a bi-weekly thing. As well as endless mind games, and power trips. But I survived, and didn't resort to becoming plastic. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: You can't tell Date & Time: 02/23/91 04:32:54 Message Number 12561 Sorry to hear about your son. They should fry the bastard, and all like him after they get gang-raped in prison. No mercy. NONE! Period. Is your son okay? =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: JONBOY Subject: Slammed Date & Time: 02/23/91 04:37:12 Message Number 12562 JB> altough I can see where you two would be best friends - mutual JB> bigot society and all that. I'm NOT a bigot. Actually I flirt with some of my /close/ male friends. We both know that we're both straight but we do joke around. Additionally, I have had several gay friends, as well as a close relative who had homosexual tendencies. I also wear boots,(you know that Black Sabbath song, "Fairies Wear Boots"?) and have three earrings in my left ear. Yes, I have laughed at by girls and recieved cat-call implying that I was gay. But I'm mine own person and if people can't expect me for me than f*ck 'em. The Specialist wouldn't have his ear pierce because I believe he feels that someone might mistake him for being gay. Me, I don't care if someone thinks that of me. Like I said I'm not a bigot. I believe that homosexuality is wrong I'm not going to try to tell someone how to live, and kill them if they won't go straight And yes, the Specialist and I have had several talks about homosexuality and we simply have agreed to disagree. Because he knows he won't chang e me, and I know it's hopeless to change his mind set about anything. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: JONBOY Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/23/91 04:47:21 Message Number 12563 JB> I happen to feel tht bigotry is a sign of an immature mind. Well then I guess my mind isn't immature, because, like I already said I'm not a bigot. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: JONBOY Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 04:48:52 Message Number 12564 Well, let me know when you want to get together and play. I'm avialable the weekend, you big stud you. (I'm not a bigot.) heheheh :) =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Do I wanna.... Date & Time: 02/23/91 04:53:17 Message Number 12565 SS> Do you really want to hear this? S> Yeah, I do. TS> Ahrhg! Don't encourage him!! Don't worry I'll post in E-mail. Since it would be addressed to Saavik and more importantly I know better than to let loose with /that/ kind of stuff in front of this bunch. Besides, I hate to see you suffer. heheh:) =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Slammed Date & Time: 02/23/91 04:57:28 Message Number 12566 TS> Don't irritate hime and discuss things with him in an intelligent TS> manner and he's pretty docile. Whoa, there. Watch it, pal(?) If you trying to piss me off, you just succeeded. Let me guess. TS> Good. Predictable. Have a day. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/23/91 05:00:17 Message Number 12567 TS> Either that or we know something that you haven't found out yet. Jonboy was refering to you and I as bigots. You know that I'm not a bigot. And where do you get this "we" shit? Do you have a mouse in your pocket? =========== From: TIBERIUS To: SAAVIK Subject: How not to Date & Time: 02/23/91 09:20:25 Message Number 12568 I'll have to get back into the swing of reading body language. I know it will take some time, but it should pay off in the long run, eh? Thanks for the tips. =========== From: KNIGHT OWL To: TURTLE Subject: protocols Date & Time: 02/23/91 12:04:10 Message Number 12570 To the best of my knowledge, the terminal also includes IBM ascii. I'll tinker with it some more just for fun. Yes, I agree, IBM color menus are really slow, I was surprisd when I saw it. SEE YA! A non-ANSI Knight Owl =========== From: KNIGHT OWL To: JONBOY Subject: origin Date & Time: 02/23/91 12:22:14 Message Number 12571 The origin of my handle comes from staying up all night. Then there was another Night Owl from the Tampa area who calls Venice periodically, so I had to make a change. Well, having survived some hard times recently I thought that Knight Owl was suitable. SEE YA! =========== From: KNIGHT OWL To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 12:30:59 Message Number 12572 I agree with you, I come from an alcoholic family and I don't have to fake anything. Coming from a dysfunctional family can be a source of strength because when you survive the early times, you can survive anything life brings you. Without honesty and reality, people are nothing but paper tigers in the wind. SEE YA! a 100% real Knight Owl =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Opinions Date & Time: 02/23/91 13:52:22 Message Number 12573 >Last time I checked, the only thing that sticks to fish is slime. That's because you're still thinking of fish, not Post-It fish. Post-It fish will stick to any smooth, nonporous substance, and peel off without leaving any adhesive residue. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: What doesn't it Date & Time: 02/23/91 13:53:33 Message Number 12574 >...but then again, what doesn't (beat Lawrence Welk). Dying in a tragic combination bus/train/avocado/airplane accident. >Are enquiring minds satisfied? No. Now they want to know every possible use for two washers and six feet of string. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/23/91 13:55:10 Message Number 12575 >...when it comes to relationships (both intimate and casual), you >never really know what's going on in the noble head of the other >person. True. >Instinct is all ya' got. Not true. The fact that you can't predict the other person's thoughts or actions is no excuse for allowing instinctive and irrational reactions like jealousy or posessiveness to interfere with good old fashioned understanding and communication, ya know? jealousy is an evil, destructive force that has no place in any relationship between any reasonable people and has no more redeeming merits than bigotry, selfishness, or any of the other petty little concerns that more appropriatley belong with lizards than with any being posessing a central nervous system more sophisticated than a brainstem. Leave the instinct to snakes and skinks; they get along just fine with nothing else. I won't model my relationships on their example, though. @(SetTirade Off) =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 14:01:30 Message Number 12576 >Do you think a person who had a sound childhood and made it past >the adolescent BS with flying colors can become insecure as an adult. Yes. I also think that people with a traumatic childhood who learned no social skills whatsoever during adolescence can become secure, well-adjusted adults. insecurity has more than one sorce, and a bad childhood is not necessarily an irreversible condemnation. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Land mines Date & Time: 02/23/91 14:03:38 Message Number 12577 >But this day and age, he who hesitates may be lost but he's not gonna >die of AIDS. I thought we were talking about "real" intimacy here. Physical intimacy is easy, but that's not what /I/ was discussing. In any event, AIDS is a controllable threat, and throughout all of human history there has only been a span of about twenty years (between the discovery of antibiotics and the appearance of antibiotic-resistent strains of social diseases) where you did NOT have to worry about a sexual liason killing you. That's something I think a lot of people have forgotten; everyone is almost outraged that the race is faced with a fatal, incurable social disease, totally forgetting that that is simply business as normal. In, say, 1852, syphillis was almost invariably fatal, and it takes years and years to kill ITS victims, too. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Clubs Date & Time: 02/23/91 14:07:14 Message Number 12578 >If the 70's were the ME age, and the 80's were the "EGO TRIP", >what do you predict for the 90's? Beats me; I never claimed to be in the fortunetelling industry. I might hazard a guess and call the 90's the age of fascist liberalism, though. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 14:08:36 Message Number 12579 >I love you means...I love and accept you and I want to be with you >and only you. You seem to be basing that assumption on the idea that you can only be "in love" with one person at a time. I catagorically deny that assumption. >Didn't you ever have a relationship with someone that wasn't going >well...but you didn't want to lose them? Yes, but I don't see your point. I still love those people. I do not "leave" a relationship. The nature of the relationship may change, but that does not mean I no longer love that person or am no longer "in love with" that person or whatever catch phrase you want to use. It sounds to me a whole lot like you are using the word "love" to mean "affection" and the phrase "in love with" to be "involved with a monogamous sexual relationship with," and if that is the case I still say the distinction between the two is Manifest Bullshit. You can still be "in love with" someone you're not sleeping with, you can be "in love with" more than one person at a time, and you can be "in love with" someone you aren't even living with. I can make these statements with absolute certainty; I know them for a /fact./ =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/23/91 14:13:39 Message Number 12580 Would his name happen to be Turtle? Bite your tongue HARD! You are unlikely to find a person who is LESS offended by bi-sexual women than Turtle. I think the person I refer to will make himself known shortly, though. =========== From: TURTLE To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: curious Date & Time: 02/23/91 14:17:46 Message Number 12581 Speaking of the next RufusCon, I've been giving some thought lately toward holding another furry party in the not-too-distant future. (Not as big as the last RufusCon, I hope; forty people in this apartment gets kind of crowded after a while.) Anyone got any ideas about acceptable times and whatnot? I'm thinking about a month down the road, on a weekend...possibly on March 23, as it's my birthday and I can massacre a number of birds with one stone that way. 'Twill also mean the Tampa contingent (Pablo, Dirty Wrat, and Bart Fox) will be likely to attend as well. =========== From: TURTLE To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/23/91 14:20:34 Message Number 12582 >Thank you Turtle for that analytical assessment. Predictable. Now what the hell was that all about? Oooooh...you wouldn't be thinking I was obliquely referring to you, were you? Stop being so paranoid; that isn't what I ment. =========== From: TURTLE To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Give God agin Date & Time: 02/23/91 14:21:46 Message Number 12583 >Actually, some of the things you find in religion (stripped of their >Godliness) are pretty good guidelines for life. What, pray tell, might those things be? I have my own views (a guideline I respect a whole lot comes from Wicca, "As it harms none, do as thou wilt), but I'd be interested to see what you would call a "good guideline" that comes out of religion. =========== From: TURTLE To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/23/91 14:23:44 Message Number 12584 >Irrlelvant. We are fighting to restore a government, irregardless [sic] >of what that government is like. Dictatorship is the *proper* govern- >ment for that country, ... Come again??? What happened to "fighting for liberty" and your supposed respect for freedom and human rights you were talking about? You sayin' people only got rights if they live in the right country and that it's "proper" for people to be tortured and murdered by their government as long as it's the "proper" government? Pardon me while I go throw up. You need a crash course in what the American Revolution was all about. =========== From: TURTLE To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/23/91 14:27:20 Message Number 12585 >NO WAY!! >Chortle...chuckle...thanks for the laugh...heheh. Um...thanks for the vote of confidence, I think. =========== From: TURTLE To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Fav Shows Date & Time: 02/23/91 14:28:31 Message Number 12586 The hippie episode is called "The Way to Eden." The Enterprise picks up a band of hippies who are searching for Eden; these hippies play an impromptu concert in the ship (with Spock on some weird triangular stringed instrument) and then suddenly decide that Eden is located in the Romulan Neutral Zone, hijack the ship by means of a device which produces a nasty, obnoxious sound that renders the crew inert, and head off for parts unknown. They steal a shuttlecraft, land on a planet, discover that all the vegetation in the lush garden they have discovered is toxic, and are majorly bummed out, dude. =========== From: RUFUS To: TURTLE Subject: What doesn't it Date & Time: 02/23/91 15:51:23 Message Number 12587 >No. Now they want to know every possible use for two washers and >six feet of string. What kind of washers? The little ones you use on bolts, the kind you stick your dirty shirts in so they come out clean, or the female type standing by the river beating a shirt with some large object in an attempt to get it clean (often found in late night barbarian movies)? If it's the last one mentioned... :) [Your a bad influence on me...] =========== From: RUFUS To: TURTLE Subject: curious Date & Time: 02/23/91 15:56:00 Message Number 12588 A month down the road sounds good to me? What about t-shirts? Has New College aqquired the equipment for making screens and shirts yet? =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: Oh, Please! Date & Time: 02/23/91 17:07:45 Message Number 12589 JB> I might send it if ya ask nice. . Oh, please, please. (batting eyelashing). =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: Rare form Date & Time: 02/23/91 17:09:37 Message Number 12590 JB> I love outspoken people. . It's easy to be outspoken when you are basically anonomous (sp?). But I think talking (typing) on the BBS about your opinions DO make you more outspoken in public. (I will NEVER, however, carry a soap box around with me.) =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: Rock & Roll daz Date & Time: 02/23/91 17:12:01 Message Number 12591 I used to sing in a band called "Concept". They are no longer in existance. Some of the guys are with "Savanah" and "Voyage", and still others are playing with themselves....er, I mean, well, you know what I mean!!!! =========== From: SAAVIK To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/23/91 17:16:21 Message Number 12592 Your are against homosexuality as a life style for yourself, that's fine. But you can't stop nor should you want to interfere with what someone else chooses to do. About the "dykes", I know a few Lesbian women. They are, with one execption, bitter towards men but in their very behavior, they are men. The one exception is a very sexy, attractiv woman......, I believe she is bi-sexual but I am not sure. She dates men occasionally but she prefers women as lovers. She is very out- spoken about it. I agree that women do not find 2 men "doing the nasty" arousing. =========== From: SAAVIK To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: curious Date & Time: 02/23/91 17:21:19 Message Number 12593 breakfast/lunch get together.....Rufuscom. Details please! I would like to go. =========== From: SAAVIK To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 17:24:59 Message Number 12594 JB> Beat me, hurt me. TS>Make me write bad checks She might get out her nightstick, and hurt me real, real bad, on the roadside....... SHE GOT ME UNDER PRESSURE (guitar rif) =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: KNIGHT OWL Subject: ********* Date & Time: 02/23/91 17:53:18 Message Number 12595 > I still haven't any idea... can ya give me another clue? Ok: how about this for a clue. The word looks something like this: CCCVCCCCC, where 'C' is a consonant, and 'V' is a vowel. The vowel is 'e', and the last letter is 's'. Second new clue: the first letter is 's.' Third new clue: I've used the word in a message to you, recently. /Dragonfly/ =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: SAAVIK Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/23/91 17:58:31 Message Number 12596 S> Men don't think "Lesbian" when they think of two women together. S> They think "Hey, ladies, room for one more???" Like it's all some S> kind of warm up to "the real thing". Bingo. Most "macho" men can't imagine why any woman wouldn't want to sleep with them. (Dripping with sarcasm) =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: TURTLE Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/23/91 18:04:18 Message Number 12597 But... but that would go against U.S. law! (completely fake shock) One of the better analyses I've seen about the war says that we're not in Iraq, really, for either Kuwait or oil. The fact is: the U.S. has been losing its "edge" over the rest of the world economically, and the only way we have of keeping control is through our military. (Which is still the largest in the world.) /Dragonfly/ =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: TURTLE Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 18:23:18 Message Number 12598 Ding. >I never could grok the distinction a lot of people see between >relationships (ie. close friendships) and Relationships; to me they >seem to be on a continuum, but a lot of people I've talked to seem >to see them as qualitatively different. the only distinctions ('flavors') I've ever made in my relationships was how close, physically, I've wanted to come to that woman, and how closely I felt I could come to her (or, for that sake, him) mentally. I've known many women who I've been very close to, mentally and emot- ionally, but had no sexual interest in. I've also known many women who I was extremely attracted to, but thought their brains were tapioca. /Dragonfly/ =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: TURTLE Subject: Lupine people Date & Time: 02/23/91 18:28:25 Message Number 12599 T> I've known /real/ scary women... Wolf isn't scary. Scary as in deadly? Not really. Scary as in a personality taken to extremes? Yes... In many ways, I /like/ Wolf, and appreciate her very physical nature, and her strong opinions. Her extreme determination, and her, well... going to extremes in everything scares me. /Dragonfly/ If you don't know who Wolf is, please ignore this message. If you do, please don't mention it to her. =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: SAAVIK Subject: Clubs Date & Time: 02/23/91 18:35:24 Message Number 12600 >What do you predict for the 90's? I'd say it'll be a slower decade than the last two, with more people trying to settle down. Why? The Baby Boom is getting older, yet. They're slowing down, so the rest of the U.S. should, right? /Dragonfly/ =========== From: DRAGONFLY To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/23/91 18:41:30 Message Number 12601 Now, you've left me confused. Can I try to sum up your message #12542? One 'feminine' woman + One 'feminine' woman = Twice the 'femininity.' One 'masculine' guy + One 'masculine' guy = No masculinity. Do I have that straight? (Pardon my pun) /Dragonfly/ =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: st Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:08:50 Message Number 12602 SS>Mine is more vulcan sounding. . Touche! But remember, Saavik came from the hostile world of Hellgaurd is part Romulan....... =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:10:26 Message Number 12603 SS>U survived, and didn't resort to becoming plastic. You were lucky. So was I. My parents had a horrible relationship with each other, but my Mother was my "best friend". I also had and still do have good relationships with my sisters. I still say a child deprived of love, will be an adult who doesn't know how to love. Just because parents don't get along with each other, doesn't mean they don't get along with their children. But it does make it difficult to teach a child about love and respect, when you don't have either for your spouse. =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: You can't tell Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:14:10 Message Number 12604 My son is doing fine now. It was rough going for a while. After the incident (for lack of a better word), he had counceling from Matt Donavon's family unit (I can't remember the name, but it's connected to HRS). They made video tapes of his sessions for the trial but the defence attorney tried to get the tapes ruled inadmissable. Months passed, and then my Son was subuenaed (sp? you know what I mean) for deposition. So that dragged the whole thing up in his mind again. Then months later as the trial drew close, the defence tried the trick with the video tape and wanted to call my son to the stand. I said "NO WAY". The asst. state's atty. Bob Lee (at the time) fought them tooth and nail. Luckily, we won that battle and the tape was ruled admissable evidence. The day of the trial (in fact it was during jury selection), the defence realized (by the responces of the prospective jurors) that they didn't have a snowballs chance in hell. He plea bargained and accepted 30 years on a lesser charge. If he had been convicted of Sexual Battery, the mandantory sentence is LIFE. Well, at least he's off the streets, eh?? =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:22:59 Message Number 12605 SS>Where do you get this "we" shit? Do you have a mouse in your pocket? . Maybe he's pregnant. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TIBERIUS Subject: How not to Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:24:43 Message Number 12606 T> I'll have to get back in the swing of body language.... . Don't get "slapped" for staring...... =========== From: SAAVIK To: KNIGHT OWL Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:26:46 Message Number 12607 KO> Without honesy and reality, people are just paper tigers in the wind . I like it!!! And I must agree. I was incorrect in saying that people from stable families, ect, grow up to be "real people". Maybe they have a better shot at it, but you are right in saying that people who have survived rough childhoods are usually stronger and more adapted to battle life's everyday trials. I sit corrected. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: fish Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:29:53 Message Number 12608 Ok, I admit ignorance. I still don't know what you're talking about. The only kind of fish I know swim. Duh! What do you do with "these" fish, if I may ask? =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:32:24 Message Number 12609 Yeah, yeah, you're right. I can't take this being wrong stuff. When I say instinct, I'm talking about "gut" feelings. Intuition. How many times have you relied on that? =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:35:03 Message Number 12610 But the person from a traumatic childhood would have to learn their social skills from someone. Where would they start? Teachers? What if they were from the getto and had no substancial role models? =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Land mines Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:37:48 Message Number 12611 You make a good point on the sexually transmitted diesize (sp?) issue. And I was orginally talking about intimate relationships and not one nighters. However, in your post about "jumping in", I thought you were referring to "picking up" people at bars and going from there. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Clubs Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:40:16 Message Number 12612 The 90's......, or a new age of war mongers...... =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:41:55 Message Number 12613 I agree to a point. I am "in love" with my best friend, and I am "in love" with my husband. I could be "in love" with all my friends. But I wasn't discussing me. I was referring to what someone might mean when they made the statement, "I love you, but I am not "in love" with you." It's a cop out. It means that you want out of the sexual, monogomous relationship but you don't want to lose the friendship. Usually the person on the other end of the conversation is hurt and I think it's just a statement meant to soften the blow. At any rate, it doens't work. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Fav Shows Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:47:44 Message Number 12614 But Doc Sevrin (was that his name?) died with a smile on his lips, didn't he? I'm going to Eden....yeah, yeah..... =========== From: SAAVIK To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:51:19 Message Number 12615 DF> most macho men can't imagine why a woman wouldn't want to sleep with them . I know the type. "Oh, baby, I got something for you......" (Puffing out his chest and sly glances at his friends) Barf!!!!!! A guy told me one time he was a giant erection. I replied. "Yeah, you look like a big dick to me." =========== From: SAAVIK To: DRAGONFLY Subject: 90's Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:54:56 Message Number 12616 You think people are slowing down? I hope so, but from what I see, the y are going 90 miles an hour. I'm talking the 30 to 40 year olds. Scratching and clawing to buy that new Beamer. I'm a working parent, I don't know what slow is anymore. But maybe the youngers are slowing down..... again, I hope so. =========== From: SAAVIK To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/23/91 19:58:08 Message Number 12617 You forgot one. One "masculine" woman + one "masculine" woman = Puking man. If the two women look like Barbara Dare then it's a turn on. But what if it's Roseann Barr and Bett Midler. Ug! =========== From: JONBOY To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/23/91 21:54:35 Message Number 12618 TS> squashing Hussien would be that easy. Actually - it's my thought that killing Hussein was never a goal of our military planning. 1) it would make the jerk a martyr 2) They want to humble the man publicly so that it will discourage similar actions in the future. Also it would discredit his remarks and support of a free Palestein and defuse any aid from that quarter ever again. =========== From: JONBOY To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Fine. Date & Time: 02/23/91 21:57:26 Message Number 12619 TS> I don't wanna offend anyone WHOOOP WHOOP WHOOOP!!!!! THe Mainifest Bullshit alarm just detected a real whopper. C'mon Dave. Stick to your guns. You stated for the record that you were infallible. It is well known that you hate gays. Now... if you are infallible then there is no one to worry about insulting as you would be correct. If you really hate gays then you shouldn't worry about it anyway as you have already offended them and can hardly worsen the stance that you have already taken. A skeptical JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/23/91 22:02:56 Message Number 12620 TS> We are fighting to restore a government, irreguardless of TS> what that government is like. Oh... so we really wanted Castro in power and the free Republic of China (based in Taiwan) will get help from us to overthrow the communist bastards that chased them out. Right? You mean we didn't help the loyal Afghanistanis chase the Russians out of their country? C'mon Dave - we have a piss-poor record of being upholders of justice. TS> and if that's the way they want to run it, that's thier TS> business. Or do you want to wish our way of running things on every TS> one else, too? Good point - kind of makes you wonder whay we don't go the extra inch and mind our own business - wouldn't you say? One might also say that these people have been trading property via warfare since Abraham 4,000 years ago and that to them it may be just doing business as usual. Again - is it OUR business to tell them how to behave? JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Slammed Date & Time: 02/23/91 22:09:40 Message Number 12621 TS> Er...yeah, I guess that he's ok. Heheheheh - you really are a warm hearted bastard too! JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/23/91 22:11:07 Message Number 12622 TS> Either that or we know something that you haven't found out yet. I guess that once the concrete sets - it really does tend to make change and acceptance of different ideas that much more difficult. Too bad the wrong stuff was molded on before the stuff cured. =========== From: JONBOY To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 22:13:01 Message Number 12623 TS> Make me write bad checks! Ok - (sotte voce) Dave! Psssst! Yeah you.... now listen vewy vewy carefully. You will awake in the morning. You will feel great. You will attribute it all to the wonderful warm glow you got from accepting the Way of the Aardvark and have a deep appreciation of the message that JonBoy gave you (even though the exact words slip away). So grateful in fact that you will pick up your checkbook, pick up a pen and donate $1,000 as a research grant to JonBoy and the Way of the Aardvark Foundation. JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 22:17:52 Message Number 12624 SS> But I survived, and didn't resort to becoming plastic. Well, against my better judgement (yes a real oxymoron!) here's a little blurb that is paraphrased from a workshop that one of profs organized in years gone by in dealing with dysfunctional families. Typical of children raised in a hostile environment is the feeling that they are merely a pawn in a game of who's right with each parent trying to get points by having more players on their side. The struggle for dominance is so intense that the children suffer in their sense of self-worth because they percieve that they have no worth outside of the power struggle framework. These people in turn become dysfunctional as they attempt to gain a feeling of worth by attaching themselves to someone that will dominate them as this is what they have been conditioned to associate as "love". Now I'm not trying to say anything about you personally because I don't know you. I do know that you have remarked on several failed relation- ships and this may or may not relate to those. A typical remark from a girl that backed out of a realtionship may be that you were "hanging" on her all the time. Enough of the Pop-Psychobabble - What I guess I would really like to say is that there are many workshops that are organized to help people that come from dysfunctional families and they can help you understand how to cope with your feelings about it and yourself. I would recommend that you investigate and it may turn out that you will benefit in ways you never imagined. Good luck bud. JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Slammed Date & Time: 02/23/91 22:30:06 Message Number 12625 SS> I'm NOT a bigot. ... I believe that homosexuality is wrong I'm not SS> going to try to tell someone how to live, and kill them if they won' SS> go straight . Well, I admire what you are trying to say if you acknowledge that gay people are in fact PEOPLE and deserve to be treated as such. I don't really know what to make of the staement that you beleive it is "wrong" as that is usually associated with a moral judgement of sorts. The message that I replied to came across as strong as most I have seen from Dave and so I (maybe wrongly) assumed that you were in the same camp. Consistency counts for a lot when making a stand on what you believe. =========== From: JONBOY To: KNIGHT OWL Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 22:36:23 Message Number 12626 KO> KO> I come from an alcoholic familily... Then you are aware of course of an organization called "Adult Children of Alcoholics" which is a subchapter of AA? A very good organization. One of my friends in Utah attended regularly as he came from an alcoholic family and he was finally learning to love his parents instead of hating them. Incidently, he also was alcoholic and attended AA also. KO> Coming from a dysfunctional family can be a source of strength Coming from a dysfunctional family is a life-crippling event and should be treated as such. You may not even be aware of all the mental damage that you have sustained. :) JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: What doesn't it Date & Time: 02/23/91 22:41:41 Message Number 12627 T> every possible use for two washers and six feet of string. I got one! I got one! You drill a hole through the back of each washer pass the string through the holes a tie a knot inside tthe drums. Then you move them apart until the string is taut and guess what! If someone yells inside one washer - the string will carry the vibration to the other washer and if someone has their head inside, he'll be able to hear the other person yelling! Wow! Your own nifty Maytag Communicators! You really should practise makking the "ChrkChrkChrk" sound of a real Star Trek communicator for realism. A helpful JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/23/91 22:48:39 Message Number 12628 T>I can make these statements with absolute certainty; I know them for T> a /fact./ Not a valid sylogism and you know it. I agree with what you say tho.. you did leave out a very important one that is responsible for an awful lot of hangups. It is possible to go to bed with someone without being in love with them. Recreational sex if you will. You realize of course that you are walking on really shaky ground in American culture. I don't know why, but so many people confuse the word "love" with anything but. My best friend gets so uncomfortable when I tell him that I love him and his wife and kids. He can accept the kids and his wife, but he has a real problem with himself. I can see it on his face. Lest this statement cause any misunderstandings (not that it /should/ matter), I am not either gay or bi - I'm as hetero as they come (or a die-hard breeder as my gay friend puts it). The word "love" has unfortunately become tangled with the concept of sexual relationships and most people don't know how to handle that on a social basis very well. The greeks had three different words to describe the varying degrees of the concept. I wish we had delineations along those lines. =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: Oh, Please! Date & Time: 02/23/91 22:59:33 Message Number 12629 SA> Oh, please, please. (batting eyelashing). Such beahavior from a married woman - I'm scandalized! :) Lemme dig in my bag of trix... hmmm I couldn't find it real quick - sorry I'll look for it. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: TURTLE Subject: Fav Shows Date & Time: 02/24/91 02:14:09 Message Number 12630 Sorry your input from "The Way to Eden" doesn't help. May /there/ a episode I haven't seen. I've still photographs in the credits of other shows, perhaps that why I thought I've seen it. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: DRAGONFLY Subject: ********* Date & Time: 02/24/91 02:20:30 Message Number 12631 Forget it, I can't get it. I'm sure I be kicking myself for it, but I give. BTW, Turtle what was the word you came up with. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/24/91 02:22:18 Message Number 12632 I take it you consider yourself not to be "macho" or are you just "studly"? :) =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/24/91 02:25:02 Message Number 12633 DF> The fact is: ths U.S. has been losing its "ege" over the rest of the world economically...... Wrong, we have been spending millions of dollars on this war, which it not helping our economy. If riase our status as a "wealthy" country then, following your logic, we should stay out of the war, and let the other countries spent /their/ money on this war. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/24/91 02:36:20 Message Number 12634 SA> Barf...Yeah, you look like a big dick to me." Hehehehe...hhahahahahaha...breathe...... God that was funny, I'd to have been the asshole who said that to you. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: SAAVIK Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/24/91 02:39:17 Message Number 12635 Ummm...where do you know Barbara Dare from? (perverted smile) =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: JONBOY Subject: Slammed Date & Time: 02/24/91 02:51:21 Message Number 12637 That's see if I can proper ly clairfy my stance on homosexuality. I think homosexuality is wrong morally. But I believe homosexuals are also human none the less. Human's are prone to mistakes. The err is human.... I don't approve of discrimination as far as jobs and rights are concerned. At the same time, I don't approve of homos adopting, being able to marry. Again, because of my moral standards. But, agai, just as much human. I don't discriminate against them. Like I said, I have had gay friends and gay co-workers. As long as they respect me and my sexual preference I have not problem with them. One guy I worked with really pissed me off, he was always hitting on me. He was a fairly new employee and needed direction. I told him to go help some other employee because I would be done before him. So he needed to assist him so that the work would get done approximately at the same time. His response was' "yeah, and the next thing you're going to want me to do is, bend over and grab my ankles." Sick. sick. Sick. =========== From: SCOTT STEEL To: JONBOY Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:00:23 Message Number 12638 KO> Coming from a dysfunctional family can be a source of stength. JB> Coming from a dysfunctional faily is a life-crippling event and shoukd treated as such. Well, I think you're both right, to an extent. KO is correct in the sense that some, not all but some, people can become stronger people. But on the other hand, JB is also correct in saying that that kind of situation can also have some damaging affects on the children as well. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:10:58 Message Number 12639 SS>and where do you get this "we" shit? DO you have a mouse in SS>your pocket? Hey, shut up. I was referring to me and other bigots (who hate fags). I wouldn't include you in with us anyway. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: TURTLE Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:13:45 Message Number 12640 T>has no more redeeming merits than bigotry, selfishness, or any of the T>other petty little concerns that more appropriately belong with T>lizards... Graaaak! - A bigoted, sauran Specialist =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: TURTLE Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:17:10 Message Number 12641 TS>Thank you Turtle for that analytical assessment. Predictable. T>Now what the hell was that all about? Just that they were discussing things from an emotional standpoint, you jumped in with a logical assessment...which was predictable. T>Oooh...you wouldn't be thinking I was obliquely referrng to you, were T>you? Stop being so paranoid; that isn't what I meant. Though I am not currently involved in any relationship with anyone, I'm certain that if I was, I would not be *that* paranoid. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: TURTLE Subject: Give God agin Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:19:54 Message Number 12642 T>"as it harms none, do as thou wilt" Sound an awful lot like "Do unto others...". Which pretty much is what I meant. Take the 10 Commandments, for instance. Don't steal, don't bear false witness, don't kill, don't covet they neighbors wife, things like that are pretty good guidelines and fairly easy to live by.... After all, I don't remember the last time I killed someone anyway.... =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: TURTLE Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:22:32 Message Number 12643 Forget it. You are not worth the effort of trying to convince anymore. You or John. You are wrong, that's simple enough. Trying to get you to understand it is like pulling teeth from a chicken...or trying to reason with a brick wall. It doesn't matter anyway. In a few short months, we'll have re-instated the proper govnt anyway. Just drop it. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: TURTLE Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:24:27 Message Number 12644 TS>Chuckle, snort guffaw! T>Thanks for the vote of confidence, i think. Welcome. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SAAVIK Subject: Rare form Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:26:35 Message Number 12645 S>But I think talking on a BBs about your opinions DO make your more S>outspoken in public. I will say anytime...I hate fags. And everyone knows it. But overall, I agree with that statement. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SAAVIK Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:28:32 Message Number 12646 S>You are against homosexuality as a lifestyle for yourself, that's S>fine. But you can't stop nor should you want to interfere with S>what someone else chooses to do. I can't stop it, that's for certain. And I don't want to interfere per se, actually, I don't want anything to do with thon's lifestyle. I simply am of the opinion that that particular person is sick, and needs to be eradicated from the face of the earth. Simple, yes? =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SAAVIK Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:31:38 Message Number 12647 S>...She got me under pressure (riff0 Ah, ZZ-TOPS! All of thier old stuff is excellent (riff!), dude! But their more recent stuff is not as good...I guess I'm just not turned on by blues. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:33:52 Message Number 12648 DF>the US has been losing its "edge" over the rest of the world DF>economically, and the only way we have of keeping control is through DF>our military. (Which is still the largest in the world.) Wrong...on both counts. Unit for unit, piece for piece, the Russian military outnumbers ours. (Except in subs.) Whoever gave you those facts was hopelessly mistaken. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:37:14 Message Number 12649 DF>Now you've got me confused. Can I try to sum up your msg? DF>One "Femme" + one "Femme" = Twice the "femme" DF>one "Masc" + one "Masc" = No masc? DF> Do I have that straight? Not exactly...let me further clarify. One masculine *looking* guy + one masculine *looking* guy is not masculine at all. What the hell is masculine about a pair of jucks up each others chutes? One beautiful *looking* femme + one beautiful *looking& femme is or looks twice as nice. But two uglys with each other is twice as ugly...and repulsive to boot. Did I help your muddled mind at all? =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SAAVIK Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:42:48 Message Number 12650 SS>Where do you get this "we" shit? Do you have a mouse in your pocket? S> Maybe he's pregnant. Maybe someone made an assumption and made an ass out of himself. (But not out of me, I hadda set him straight.) =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: JONBOY Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:46:15 Message Number 12651 Oh, right, my point exactly. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: JONBOY Subject: Fine. Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:46:46 Message Number 12652 You better repair your MB alarm; apparently it is in dire need of maintainence. I never stated that I was infallible. And it is well known that I hate FAGGOTS. And if I were infallible, then there is or would be no one to insult, because I would be correct...but this is based on your ASSUMPTION that I think that I am infallible. But there are people out there who act like gays and are not.... Though, what you say is true. If I say that someone acts gay and they are as "open minded" as you and Turtle, then they shouldn't be offended at being compared to someone who likes to stick his dick in "Outgoing Only" places.... Or to some cocksucker. Am I being offensive yet? Oh, so sorry. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: JONBOY Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:51:37 Message Number 12653 Usesless. Simply useless. It's quite clear that you simply can't be convinced of the error of your way of thinking. I refer you to the message I wrote Turtle. Have a nice day. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: JONBOY Subject: Slammed Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:52:39 Message Number 12654 JB> Hehehe - you really are a warm hearted bastard too! Oh, I have always had good things to say about you, John...no matter how misinformed you are or however many incorrect conclusions you draw. I've always said, yeah, that JB...he's a real SOB. But SOB can stand for Swell ol' Boy, too. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: JONBOY Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:54:34 Message Number 12655 TS> Either that or we know something that you haven't found out yet. JB>...once the concrete sets -...[blah, blah]. Too bad the wrong stuff JB>was molded on before the stuff cured. Save your sympathy for yourself, JB. I should be the one sympathising for your misguided person. =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: JONBOY Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/24/91 03:57:06 Message Number 12656 No, no...you don't get it! It's part of an expression... Hurt me, beat me, make me write bad chekcs! =========== From: THE SPECIALIST To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Homos in the WP Date & Time: 02/24/91 04:02:10 Message Number 12657 SS>"the next thing you're gont to want me to do is to bend over and SS>grab my ankles. " SIck, sick, sick. I couldn't have said it better than that. Except I might have added how I proceded to grab the nearest single weapon and beat the man senseless. (Whatever came to hand.) I swear to God if it were in my power I would have. I swear to GOD. =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: Workshops Date & Time: 02/24/91 08:34:07 Message Number 12658 Good post. (about the workshops for children from dysfunctional families Many people don't realize how affected they were by their family problems until they start talking about it. Posting on this BBS is good therapy, too. =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: What doesn't it Date & Time: 02/24/91 08:37:34 Message Number 12659 JB> (using Maytag communicator) You really should practise making the "ChrkChrkChrk" sound of a real Star Trek Communicator.... . It would bring a whole new meaning to "Beam me up, Scotty." =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/24/91 08:40:07 Message Number 12660 What three words did the Greeks have to describe the different variations of love. -----A Curious Saavik =========== From: SAAVIK To: JONBOY Subject: Scandalized Date & Time: 02/24/91 08:41:44 Message Number 12661 Hey, JB. I'm married, I'm not dead. I still know how to bat my eyelashes It's a skill we women NEVER forget. =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: The way to Eden Date & Time: 02/24/91 08:43:07 Message Number 12662 You must have seen it......, remember, one of the women in the "hippie" group was an old flame of Chekov's? The "hippie" group was running around the Enterprise trying to "corrupt" the crew into following them. It was one of the earlier T.V. shows that addressed "Cults"..... There have been many since but not ST. Dr. Sevrin was the "hippie" leader. A brilliant but insane man. (evil genius). Sevrin had a deadly diseise that threatened anyone who wasn't immune to it. Spock took over the search for Eden. The last scene of the episode showed Dr. Sevrin hanging dead in a tree after taking a bite of a toxic fruit. =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/24/91 08:51:34 Message Number 12663 It didn't phase him a bit. He just smiled and started advertising free pap smears to all the women at the party. You just can't insult some people........ =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/24/91 08:52:39 Message Number 12664 SS>Where do you know Barbara Dare from? (perverted smile) . No comment..... (batting eyelashes again) =========== From: SAAVIK To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Slammed Date & Time: 02/24/91 08:54:18 Message Number 12665 In reference to the gay employee..... there are extremists everywhere. Just as their are "flaming" gays, their are women who constantly make suggestive remarks..., It doens't mean that they actually MEAN them. I worked with a guy that kept hitting on me and I know for a fact that if I had taken him seriously, he would have run for the hills. =========== From: SAAVIK To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Amen Date & Time: 02/24/91 09:00:03 Message Number 12666 TS> Simple, yes? . OH, yes. Very simple...... =========== From: SAAVIK To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/24/91 09:00:52 Message Number 12667 I don't prefer ZZ tops new stuff either. I really like the older tunes like Tush, Heard it on the..., you know what I mean??? I also am astonished that the Doobie Brothers managed to sell that last album. Talk about ripping on old songs by putting new lyrics....., Arg. =========== From: KNIGHT OWL To: SAAVIK Subject: Rock & Roll daz Date & Time: 02/24/91 09:49:46 Message Number 12668 S>... and still others are playing with themselves...er, I mean, well, you know what I mean!!!! I got a good laugh outta that! I beleive the word that escaped you was 'solo'. SEE YA! Knight Owl =========== From: SAAVIK To: KNIGHT OWL Subject: Rock & Roll daz Date & Time: 02/24/91 12:43:09 Message Number 12669 Yeah, absolutely, solo was what I meant. They are playing and singing to the walls...... Ah, they'll be back in bands before long.., it gets in your blood. "It's like bad medicine." =========== From: TURTLE To: RUFUS Subject: What doesn't it Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:06:53 Message Number 12670 >What kind of washers? The kind you stick a golf ball in and move the handle thing up and down, of course. What else? >[Your a bad influence on me...] I don't hang out with the wrong kind of people, I AM the wrong kind of people! :) =========== From: TURTLE To: RUFUS Subject: curious Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:08:09 Message Number 12671 >A month down the road sounds good to me? Okay, I'll plan it then? Assuming it's cool with everyone else? >Has New College aqquired the equipment for making screens and shirts >yet? I don't know. It's possible that Nick can do it, though...I should look into it. *Sigh* =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: curious Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:12:22 Message Number 12672 >Details please! The Suncoast City Joint Indoor Monthly Picnick occurrs about once a month, usually at ten AM, in some relatively obscure and inexpensive restaraunt (lately Chef Paul's has been a favorite, but they've also taken place in the hospital cafeteria, at the now-defunct Le Croissant, and other bizzare places). RufusCon is a very large annual convention in honor of our very own Rufus that takes place in my apartment. The last RufusCon (RufusCon '90) attracted more than forty people, and a live band...I kid you not. =========== From: TURTLE To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:15:44 Message Number 12673 >...the only way we have of keeping control is through our military. >(Which is still the largest in the world.) Begging your pardon, but our military is NOT the largest in the world and isn't even close. It is the best-trained, best-equipped military force in the world, and it's one of the very few left that's still all- volunteer, but it is far from the largest. China and the Soviet Union both have about /twice as many/ active military personnel... =========== From: TURTLE To: DRAGONFLY Subject: Lupine people Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:18:30 Message Number 12674 >If you don't know who Wolf is, please ignore this message. Get serious. I'm very familiar with the lady in question. Yes, she gets carried away with just about everything she does, but I don't find that "scary" at all...simply mildly annoying. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: fish Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:21:32 Message Number 12675 Post-It fish also swim, but if they don't swim in pairs (stuck together) they tend to get stuck to other things, like rocks and boats and other fish. At least they peel off easily, though. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:22:34 Message Number 12676 >When I say instinct, I'm talking about "gut" feelings. Intuition. >How many times have you relied on that? I always /listen to/ my gut feelings, but I try not to /rely/ on them at all. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:23:43 Message Number 12677 People can find role models anywhere--friends, teachers, etc, etc. You learn by doing, and that goes with social skills as much as with anything else. It's more difficult if your family is an unhappy one, but it isn't impossible. =========== From: TURTLE To: SAAVIK Subject: Wax paper Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:25:38 Message Number 12678 >It ["I love you, but I'm not 'in love' with you] is a cop out. Ding. >It means you want out of the sexual, monogamous relationship but you >don't want to lose the friendship. ...therefore implying that the statement "I love you" means "I am emotionally intimate with you" and "I am in love with you" means "I'm sexually attracted to you." You wouldn't think it'd be that easy to confuse love and lust. =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: Aardvarkians!! Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:31:18 Message Number 12679 >...donate $1,000 as a research grant to JonBoy and the Way of the >Aardvark Foundation. Hey! The Way of the Aardvark, as all /true/ disciples know, is the way to spiritual enlightenment, not financial gain! You shall be condemned to a world without Mountain Dew if you continue this false teaching, you know... =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: What does it? Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:34:36 Message Number 12680 >Wow! Your own nifty Maytag Communicators! Well, I must admit that was one I didn't think of...what are all the rest? =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: Helicopters Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:35:38 Message Number 12681 >Not a valid syllogism and you know it. It wasn't a syllogism at all. I was not trying to imply that it's true because I know it to be so; I know it's true because I have seen it firsthand, on several occasions. >...love has become entangled with the concept of sexual relations and >most people don't know how to handle that on a social basis very well. Ding. Same goes for physical affection--most people assume any affectionate physical contact between a man and a woman is inherently sexual in nature. Silliest damn idea I ever heard of. =========== From: TURTLE To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: ********* Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:38:29 Message Number 12682 >BTW Turtle, what was the word you came up with. "Strengths." Adjective form "strong"; spelled completely differently. =========== From: TURTLE To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:43:10 Message Number 12683 >Just that they were discussing things from an emotional standpoint, >you jumped in with a logical assessment...which was predictable. Naturally I'm the sort of person with a computer for a brain who makes Mr. Spock look downright warm and friendly, huh? Hardly--I was just pointing out that if you base your relationships strictly on emotional reactions and never bother to think about what you're doing, you become a statistic (of the "three quarters of all couples who married in the eighties will end up divorced" variety [Omni, March 1991]). =========== From: TURTLE To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: Give God agin Date & Time: 02/24/91 13:46:24 Message Number 12684 >Sounds an awful lot like "Do unto others..." No, the Wiccan idea is much more sophisticated than the Golden Rule. The Golden Rule applies ONLY to the way you interact with other people; for example, if you are burying toxic waste outside some town somewhere, it can be argued that you aren't doing anything to anyone else (at least not directly), where the Wiccan idea would very clearly consider this behavior immoral. Ditto for cutting down rainforests. The Wiccan ideal is both broader and better able to guide interpersonal interactions. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: curious Date & Time: 02/24/91 16:15:40 Message Number 12685 Will Rufuscon 90 be by invitation only? Will this auspicious occasion be posted??? A live band beats a dead band, you know...... =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: fish Date & Time: 02/24/91 16:17:37 Message Number 12686 Post it fish sound flat as a flounder to me. I prefer bass. But they get stuck on things too. Weeds, underwater trees, and of course, our friends, the alligator. =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/24/91 16:18:53 Message Number 12687 It is wise not to rely on "gut feeling" alone. But have you found that as you grow older, your "gut feelings" grow wiser? =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/24/91 16:20:09 Message Number 12688 True, there are role models everywhere but they are not always good ones People from love deprived childhoods are apt to choose the wrong role models. (I may regret saying that). It just seems to me, that many of the people trying to influence the youth of today, are not that great of role models.... =========== From: SAAVIK To: TURTLE Subject: Wax paper Date & Time: 02/24/91 16:22:08 Message Number 12689 T> You wouldn't think it'd be that easy to confuse love and lust (speaking of plastic people and I love you I am not in love with you) . Ding...back at ya. I hate using this term again and again, but "plastic people" are usually self centered. Love is great, but it can get pretty boring compared to the "newness" of infactuation. I think thats why certain individuals might coin that phrase "I love you but....". Love is a bond that grows with time and doesn't fade because somebody "better" comes along. Lust is a flash in the pan, once it's satisfied and everyday reality seeps in, it's too cold to hang around. =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Give Peace agin Date & Time: 02/24/91 20:53:27 Message Number 12691 SS> Wrong, we have been spending millions of dollars on this war, which SS> it not helping our economy. Actually - a major war should be very good for the economy as it stimulates R&D and gets rid of the weapons stockpile which will need to be replentished and also the major surge in services purchased by the govt in support of the war effort. sad to say war makes money. =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Slammed Date & Time: 02/24/91 20:56:57 Message Number 12692 SS> His response was' "yeah, and the next thing you're going to SS> want me to do is, bend over and grab my ankles." Sick. sick. Sick. Actually - the analogy of "getting bent over" is quite common in the workplace with the corresponding "getting the shaft", "grease it up before you go in" etc etc. Mayhaps you misunderstood. I have only had one gay "hit" on me and it was only because he felt comfortable enough with me to know that I would not be offended. =========== From: JONBOY To: SCOTT STEEL Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/24/91 21:00:46 Message Number 12693 SS> some, not all but some, people can become stronger people. Is that strength merely a hard shell to keep the world out? The word strength carries a lot of connotations and unfortunately in our society the male is expected to be the "strong silent type". I would that men in this country could learn to hug as a good start. Americans are considered to be a very cold impersonal people by the erst of the world. American men have a personal space of about 18" for friends and about 25" to 36" for strangers. Europeans reduce that amount by half for interpersonal communication and Arabs get right in each others face. They say that they need to "share breath" as a sign of friend- liness. Arab men also hold hands with their friends which has caused more than one misunderstanding with Americans. Heck with it. My personal campaign is to hug anyone that is dear to me and f*ck anyone that feels it isn't manly. JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: "Slapped" Date & Time: 02/24/91 21:08:16 Message Number 12694 TS> TS> Graaaak! - A bigoted, sauran Specialist I love it Dave! Y'know I actually have a book dealing with interpersonal relationships on the job called "Dinosaur Brains" and the authors premise is that most people problems are in fact caused by our remnant of our dinosaur brain taking control before the cortex can get ahold of it. He refers to it as Lizard Logic and says that all things can be expressed as variations of these ancient drives: Get it Now - (impatience) Fight, Flight or Fright Pecking Order (it's lonely at the top) The Captain Kirk Management Style (the actual chapter heading!) Mating Urges etc etc. Best book I ever bought on the subject and it is actually fun to read and he offers very good realistic coping strategies. BOOK: Dinosaur Brains (or how to deal with/Those/ impossible people at work) Albert J. Bernstein John Wiley publications =========== From: JONBOY To: THE SPECIALIST Subject: welcome Date & Time: 02/24/91 21:20:59 Message Number 12695 TS> I should be the one sympathising for your misguided person. Ok - you have my permission. I will leave my thoughts clear and wait for that warm wave of sympathy to come rolling in and wash me in your infinite compassion and understanding. C'mon Dave - quit being so damned snotty. You used to be able to disagree without getting personal and/or obnoxious. I have even defended your right to bigotry because it IS your right. Let's lay off the personal attacks. I'm sorry if the snide comments about concrete sting. I intend them to. I try very hard to make them slightly indirect and funny so that you can tell that I don't mean them in a hateful derogatory fashion. We can disagree and call each other jerks but still remain gentlemen - ok? JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: Workshops Date & Time: 02/24/91 21:29:25 Message Number 12696 SA>Posting on this BBS is good therapy, too. I dunno - I have visions of The Specialist taking a bayonet to his personal "Gay Bob" doll after he logs off here. It may cause a lot of stress for some people. :) JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: What doesn't it Date & Time: 02/24/91 21:31:09 Message Number 12697 SA> It would bring a whole new meaning to "Beam me up, Scotty." Yeah - I got it! we change it from a string to a vacuum hose and rig a cuisinart inside the drum. You climb in, turn it on and after it has blended you the hose sucks you to the other end. Ummmm the technology on the other end needs work though... A sick JonBoy (at least Wratt sez so) =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: Plastic people Date & Time: 02/24/91 21:33:23 Message Number 12698 SA> What three words did the Greeks have to describe the different SA> variations of love. -----A Curious Saavik Umm jeez put me on the spot! My memory is going with advanced age and the senility don't help... AGAPE' - transcendent love used to describe the type of love that God has for man or man for his fellow man. THELO' - love ascribed to things - like women love shoes, the fella that is in love with his new corvette etc. Phileo - Love between friends, family, acquaintences. It is helpful anytime (if you read the Bible) you see the word "love" to look up in a good concordance exactly what type of love is being referred to. JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: SAAVIK Subject: Scandalized Date & Time: 02/24/91 21:40:08 Message Number 12699 SA> Hey, JB. I'm married, I'm not dead. I still know how to bat my SA> eyelashes It's a skill we women NEVER forget. Lest you get out of practice hey? (heheh) anyway I did keep my promise and dug it out. Here is my (semi) famous Bill Bixie Cat. Please note that the leftmost reverse comma SHOULD be a back-slash but this BBS software thinks that's end of line. Her tis. +-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-+ _ /| ] ` o O' ] =(_v_)= ] / U ] Ack! Phht! ] --* JonBoy *-- ] =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-+ Ummm - please adjust your set - may have had tabs in it. The ears and oops excuse - the whiskers and cheeks need to be moved left one characte =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: Aardvarkians!! Date & Time: 02/24/91 21:48:09 Message Number 12700 T> condemned to a world without Mountain Dew if you continue this T>false teaching, you know... Tis written (wherever that tome may be) that there will be many false teachers of The One True Way. Errrr I'm trying to flush them out! Honest! An underground disciple JonBoy ===========